1973 Tucker Sno Cat 1443 New to Me

[Track Addict]

Searched the stash found a front table with all surfaces new spec. This one most have come off a cat early in its life.

Will have to enlarge the tie rod hole. Early tables seemed to use smaller tie ties tapers.

This sped the project up a bit which is nice for a change.

 

[Track Addict]

Table

 

[Track Addict]

Going to take the time and add a bronze bushing to the pivot. Figure if it ever wears I won't have to pull everything off and mill it just jack it up and roll the entire front end out from under the cat and change.

Although it will probably be my children's children's issue by then and snow might not be a thing anymore.

Going to abandon the oil pan and leaks for this year. After looking under there think there are a few other leaks one of which might be a rear main. Doesn't leak a lot and might become cluster.

Maybe next year pull the motor and tranny transfer and freshen those up with gaskets and seals.

 

[sno-drifter]

As long as you have that virgin fifth wheel, I would spin up an additional roller, take out the spacer and you have reduced the psi on the aluminum fifth wheel. Now you are looking at great grand children needing to work on the cat.

 

[Track Addict]

Brilliant suggestion. Thanks for the tip that is now the plan!

 

[Aaron Tucker]

As long as you have that virgin fifth wheel, I would spin up an additional roller, take out the spacer and you have reduced the psi on the aluminum fifth wheel. Now you are looking at great grand children needing to work on the cat.

thats the tucker snocat weak point.

 

[Track Addict]

Here is what we are working with. Looking at the overspray this is all original setup. Some photos of the wear. You can see between the trunion wear, roller wear, and rear pivot wear this cat has been tabled for a while.

Roller must have been about 2.500” when New and is now down to 2.473” on flat spot where it must have been stuck and 2.490” consistent on the round areas. Bearings inside the roller and on the trunion all in good shape.

As suggested a longer roller seems like a no brainer upgrade.

Need to take up some front to back slop, turn a longer and bigger diameter roller to raise the table back up and also some sort of wear bushing under the rear pivot. Bush the rear pivot and take up trunion carrier wear.

Leaning toward bearing tape in the trunion carrier. Wear is just like the carriers and there is not a lot of meat to bore and bush.

Open to input and what not to do.

 

[Track Addict]

Springs and hangers all milled out to 3/4. Will bush back to 5/8.

Tie rod end and retainer screw cams right out of donor table. Formulated a good repair / upgrade for the front assembly.

Parts ordering and cleaning parts this week.

 

[Track Addict]

Springs and hangers all bushed.

Made a template for the upgraded 1/4” stainless plate that the new bronze roller will ride on and protect the table.3 counter sunk screws to hold the plate on. Decided on stainless for ease of friend who is making has access and no rust or paint needed. Allowed enough clearnce so as wear occurs carrier will clear plate.

Got the bronze stock for the new roller and some bronze thrust washers. Will add bronze washer everwhere metal to metal exists trunion and one on each side of the new roller. All the original steel roller/bushings will be abandoned.

Tucker didn’t seem to allow much clearance between the trunion carrier and the rail. Will add a bronze thrust in the rear to raise up to allow some wear before needing service. The plate will raise the front so we will turn down the OD of the roller to adjust.

Even with alll that i need to mill some material off the front hanger to allow the trunion to raise. Tight tolerances. With replacement parts back in the day was never an issue.

Little machine work hopefully over the weekend and off to sandblast for this portion of rebuild.

Hope this is a sound upgrade. Think I sourced enough wisdom from you all and came up with a good plan.

Will make the cat serviceable for years to come and allow off the shelf repair in the future.

 

[Track Addict]

Was bored tonight so made the night more boring before I was bushed so called it a night!

This table had an interesting steel tapered reducer bushing in the tie rod hole pressed in. Took out and still had a clean taper. Opened it up to the heavier soze for my ends.

 

[Pontoon Princess]

looks great

 

[DAVENET]

I've always wondered why the roller was allowed to have direct contact with that aluminum table. You have a pristine one, but almost every other table out there has the massive wear grooves. That being said, I'm betting that if you made more than one, you (or your buddy) would certainly have a market for everyone looking for an economical, long term fix. Hell, I can even think of a place to use one of those . . .

 

[Track Addict]

Have a few tables with inlay steel plates. Most are also worn and one was ripped right out.

Back when you could buy parts none of this mattered. Challenge with the plate is turning the roller to fit and shimming the rear pivot. The front trunion hanger also needs machininf to allow more clearance.

Let me know if and when your cat gets to that point. There will probably be a repair app by then!

 

[sno-drifter]

An alternative to shimming the rear pivot is to install a taller insert and a spacer under the horizontal surface of the trunnion equal to the increased height of the plate/ larger diameter roller.

 

[Track Addict]

Going to take a few steps back on this project to take some better steps forward.

Got a new phone this week and yesterday I noticed I had no voicemails since Tuesday. Reset some things and a number of them came down from the mysterious could. A very important one Drifted across I missed this earlier this week and wish I had not. Thanks in Advance!

I had addressed the trunion pivot forward motion and wear with the bronze bushing. What I did not really address fully was the load above the pivot on the table and that wear surface. My solution was a high load bronze thrust washer. One side it touches is the steel trunion above the pivot and the other side is the aluminum table. Issue with my current design is that unless the thrust washer magically stays glued to the table and doesn't move it will eat into the table over time. Also not a lot of surface area here.

Scott is 100% correct above. What I should have done is installed a taller bushing so top of the bushing was proud of the table creating the wear surface I need. That would wear over time and then replace before it hits the table. Drawback is that you would need to bottom the bushing so next removal in the blind hold with a puller will make next service more difficult.

Alternatively he suggested shimming under the pivot in which case the trunion rides on the bottom of the pivot bore in the table and you could watch the trunion to table gap close and once close service and replace. I like this due to the larger surface wear areas but you still have the potential for thrust washer in the bore to wear into the aluminum. Here I I think you could retainer a bottoms washer to prevent that aluminum wear and add a second one on top.

How about taking the best of all these worlds?

 

[Track Addict]

New Plan:

1. Remove the bronze busing I just pressed and replace it with a bronze flange bushing. This will eliminate need for a bronze thrust washer and the potential for the thrust washer to turn and wear into the table. A taller busing would do the same thing but the flange will allow me a gap without bottoming for a puller.

2. Shim under the pivot in the table bore with bronze thrust washers.

The grease zerk in the table pivot cup/bore will allow allow greasing of the bronze below the pivot as well as the pivot point for the forward motion. This appears to be a larger surface area than the upper trunion pivot area. If I can get both to bear the weight and use both surfaces even better.

If pulling my newly installed pivot bushing is too difficult I will insert the thrust washer above the table and under the pivot back into the plan. Right now if I add 2 1/8" bronze thrust washers in the bore I get either my 1/8 flange bushing or thrust washer under the upper pivot point with little clearance. In either solution once the upper pivot touches you still should have good service live and an advanced warning before you damage the table ever. At least under my watch.

Next person to service this upgrade will only have to takes off the tie rod, driveshaft, front trunion table holder then jacks up the front and rolls the assembly off. Few off the shelf bushings and washers some basic machining skills and you just got another life with little hassle. Much like the rear now has UHMW blocks for ease of service.

After all this front roller will be turned to compensate for plate and keep geometry all even.

Think this is a good result from the wisdom of many!

 

[Track Addict]

Here is some idea pics.

Last the trunion carrier needs another gusset. One is factory thereis room for another so going to add it.

 

[Track Addict]

Ordered some more parts and paint.

Added a drain plug for the diff. Magnetic plug will replace this one after paint.

Fabed up the additional trunion carrier brace ready for welding.

 

[Track Addict]

Improved flange bushing design compete. Much better solution.

Bronze thrust below the trunion all shimmed. Hope to have my plate beginning next week to finish the roller.

Priming and painting finished pieces begins.

Think I have all the parts and pieces in or on they way.

 

[Pontoon Princess]

you are getting pretty good at machine work...

 

[Blackfoot Tucker]

you are getting pretty good at machine work...

Totally agree! Great idea, beautifully executed!

 

[Track Addict]

Gusset

 

[Track Addict]

Bearing tape my friend and maybe yours!

Took up the trunion wear nicely.

Roller side has more wear than pivot side. Most likely due to roller not touching and carrier riding direct on table.

 

[Track Addict]

Priming some parts.

Only thing noteworthy here is the front axle housing used doubled up hanger brackets where as the rear only used one? Doesn’t seem to be a thread length issue. Tucker wonderment!

 

[sno-drifter]

Hope that you removed both tie rod ends, cleaned the threads and painted them with anti-seize. Now is the time to do it in the event that one breaks and you have to change out in the bush. Just sayin.

 

[Track Addict]

Even better is they were already loose and one appears to have been replaced in life.

 

[Pontoon Princess]

did you remember to bush the spring bolt holes in the fifth wheels, big wear item!

 

[Track Addict]

I did remember but did not do. Wanted to leave something to keep the three alive. These ones are virgin bore. Figured it will be a good project for the boys in another few decades.

The ones on my 442A were also not worn out after all those years. Seems like some had the bolts freeze in the table and never pivot putting the wear in the hanger brackets.

Little retainer helps also to hold the shank in a nice table bore.

 

[sno-drifter]

I noticed in earlier post no. 468, that it looks to these old eyes that there is a crack running north and south on the diff housing beside the oil drain plug. Perhaps this is intentional for chainsaw bar oiling, what do I know.

 

[Track Addict]

The castings on all 4 of these I have done have this crusty weld slag on top. I grind it clean before painting but does look just like a crack.