• Please be sure to read the rules and adhere to them. Some banned members have complained that they are not spammers. But they spammed us. Some even tried to redirect our members to other forums. Duh. Be smart. Read the rules and adhere to them and we will all get along just fine. Cheers. :beer: Link to the rules: https://www.forumsforums.com/threads/forum-rules-info.2974/

The Myth of the Holocaust

Melensdad

Jerk in a Hawaiian Shirt & SNOWCAT Moderator
Staff member
In this day and age it amazes me what still is being said. How can people be so stupid? Below is he un-edited text, as published by FOX.com and reported by the AP.





Iranian President Calls Holocaust a 'Myth'

Wednesday, December 14, 2005

service_ap_36.gif


TEHRAN, Iran — Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad escalated his anti-Israeli rhetoric Wednesday, calling the Holocaust a "myth" used by Europeans to create a Jewish state in the heart of the Islamic world.

"Today, they have created a myth in the name of Holocaust and consider it to be above God, religion and the prophets," Ahmadinejad told thousands of people in the southeastern city of Zahedan.

His remarks drew swift condemnation from Israel, Germany and the European Commission. Germany said the remarks would affect upcoming negotiations over Iran's nuclear program.

Ahmadinejad last week questioned whether the Nazi destruction of 6 million European Jews during World War II occurred and said Israel should be moved to Europe. He also provoked an international outcry in October when he called for Israel to be "wiped off the map."

But Wednesday was the first time he publicly denied the Holocaust. Touring southeast Iran, Ahmadinejad said that if Europeans insist the Holocaust happened, then they are responsible and should pay the price.

"If you committed this big crime, then why should the oppressed Palestinian nation pay the price?" Ahmadinejad asked rhetorically.

"This is our proposal: if you committed the crime, then give a part of your own land in Europe, the United States, Canada or Alaska to them so that the Jews can establish their country," he said, developing a theme he raised in Saudi Arabia last week.

German Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier called the remarks "shocking and unacceptable." He said the German government had summoned the Iranian charge d'affaires to make "unmistakably clear" its displeasure.

"I cannot hide the fact that this weighs on bilateral relations and on the chances for the negotiation process, the so-called nuclear dossier," Steinmeier said, referring to European talks with Iran on its nuclear program.

Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesman Mark Regev said: "The repeated outrageous remarks of the Iranian president show clearly the mind-set of the ruling clique in Tehran and indicate clearly the extremist policy goals of the regime.

"The combination of fanatical ideology, a warped sense of reality and nuclear weapons is a combination that no one in the international community can accept," Regev added, referring to allegations that Iran is developing nuclear bombs.

In Brussels, Belgium, European Commission spokeswoman Emma Udwin said the president's comments were "completely unacceptable."

"We feel very strongly that Iran is damaging its own interests with these kind of remarks," she said.

Ahmadinejad said the West had harmed Muslims, invaded their countries and plundered their wealth.

"If your civilization consists of aggression, making oppressed people homeless, suffocating the voices of justice and bringing poverty to a majority of the world's people, we say loudly that we hate your hollow civilization," he said.

Ahmadinejad has been unapologetic about taking Iran on a more openly defiant course, insisting on Iran's right to develop its nuclear program — which it insists is peaceful — and often using rhetoric reminiscent of the 1980s heyday of the Islamic Revolution.

The president's views sharply conflict with those of predecessor Mohammad Khatami, a moderate who used to call for dialogue among civilizations and promoted a low-key understanding with the United States that stopped short of diplomatic relations.

Inside Iran, Ahmadinejad's remarks have been criticized by some of his conservative allies, who fear he is hurting the country's image. Moderate Iranians have called on the ruling Islamic establishment to rein in the president.

But Supreme leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, who has the ultimate say, has backed Ahmadinejad's calls for Israel's elimination.

Ahmadinejad criticized the United States for refusing to sell Iran spare parts for its civilian planes as part of its long-standing embargo against the country.

Iran has suffered a series of plane accidents — most recently on Dec. 6, when an aging U.S.-made military transport plane crashed into a tall building in Tehran, killing 115 people. Iranian officials have blamed Washington for the crashes, saying they are partly caused by the difficulty in obtaining spare parts.

"No country is authorized to impose spare-part sanctions against another country. Nothing can justify this," Ahmadinejad said Wednesday.

Ahmadinejad said the denial of spare parts was a reason why Iran would not trust Western promises to give it nuclear fuel. The country is currently at loggerheads with the West over its insistence on enriching uranium to fuel its first nuclear reactor, which is due to start generating electricity next year.

The Europeans, with U.S. backing, do not trust Iran to have its own enrichment process since highly enriched uranium can be used for nuclear warheads. Europe has offered to sell enriched uranium for the reactor, but Iran has rejected this.

The United States is pushing to have Iran referred to the U.N. Security Council, where it could face sanctions for violating a nuclear arms control treaty.

Ahmadinejad said that if Iran gave in on the nuclear dispute, there was no guarantee the West might not refuse to sell nuclear fuel in the future.

"I assure you that we won't step back one inch from our nuclear rights," the president told the crowd, drawing chants of "Death to America!"

Iran is due to resume negotiations on the nuclear issue with envoys from Britain, France and Germany starting Dec. 21 in Vienna, Austria.

 
I don't know, maybe I'm close minded, but I've always had a hard time wanting anything to do with countries who constantly burn American flags and chant "death to America". Maybe it's just me, but I have a huge problem with extending foreign aid to any of those countries. You know we all spend quite a bit of our money giving it to people who want to kill us, trying to befriend them. I just don't get it.
 
Hey, that guy is no worse than Americans who call Democrats "loonies"...he's just suffering from delusions. Maybe he needs to get laid.
 
OkeeDon said:
Hey, that guy is no worse than Americans who call Democrats "loonies"...he's just suffering from delusions. Maybe he needs to get laid.


Oh Don, come on now. There is ample evidence to prove that the Holocaust existed AND that Democrats are loonies :whistle:

OK well not all Democrats are loonies, after all there are some conservative Blue Dog Democrats down south! :tiphat:

But seriously, that guy is the leader of a nation and I'm sure he is making sure that all the history books in the schools have a re-written view of history that expresses his views. Sort of goes back to Dargo's point about foreign aid. How can we ever hope to become friends with people who actually believe the stuff this guy is saying? There will be a whole generation of people growing up believing the holocaust didn't occur.
 
AP Article stated: said:
Ahmadinejad last week questioned whether the Nazi destruction of 6 million European Jews during World War II occurred and said Israel should be moved to Europe.

If you think about it, his solution of moving Israel to Europe would certainly solve a lot of problems.

Heck I'd welcome the Nation of Israel to our shores, we could carve out a space of equivalent size from somewhere.

Israel is a very productive and inventive nation, they share many of our core values, and they recieve a huge amount of our foreign aid. We could move them here, have a friend within our borders, give their nation to the Palestinians to provide them with the home they desire, reduce our overall foreign air outlays, and we'd defuse the entire reason that Al Quiada exists all at the same time.
 
Dargo said:
I don't know, maybe I'm close minded, but I've always had a hard time wanting anything to do with countries who constantly burn American flags and chant "death to America". Maybe it's just me, but I have a huge problem with extending foreign aid to any of those countries. You know we all spend quite a bit of our money giving it to people who want to kill us, trying to befriend them. I just don't get it.

AMEN!

No more money to countries that oppose our views. National debt taken care of!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
B_Skurka said:
Heck I'd welcome the Nation of Israel to our shores, we could carve out a space of equivalent size from somewhere.
Great idea!!! I vote for a strip, a few miles wide that extends from E. Texas to the Pacific. To make it easy, lets use our border as the line and come inward 2 miles.

I wonder what that would do to our illegal immigration problem.
 
OkeeDon said:
Hey, that guy is no worse than Americans who call Democrats "loonies"...he's just suffering from delusions. Maybe he needs to get laid.
You Go BIG DON !! That's the goal of all Democrats "GET LAID" !!!!!(can they incorporate that into the next major election.........A hand in every snatch & A snatch in every hand !!)...........I may have to cross over yet..............
 
I applaud both Bob and BC's thinking outside of the box. :applause:

That could work!!!
 
Not funny. You'd be RIPPED if you saw something similar from the Muslim world about the Bible. You'd consider it reason enough to nuke 'em. If you think about it (if possible, which is in doubt since you think that's funny), your little cartoon may be all the justification they need to be a tad upset with us.
 
OkeeDon said:
Not funny. You'd be RIPPED if you saw something similar from the Muslim world about the Bible. You'd consider it reason enough to nuke 'em. If you think about it (if possible, which is in doubt since you think that's funny), your little cartoon may be all the justification they need to be a tad upset with us.

Don, I've got to agree. In the same spirit of honesty and fairness exhibited in another thread here where a racist remark was directed at a person of the Muslim religion, there really is a double standard many people apply. Now I think HUMOR ME is actually trying to be humorous, while in the other thread there were words typed in anger. But the reality is Don is 100% correct that this is simply an insult to an entire religion, and the majority of the members of that religion are non-violent peace loving people. Many of htem are even red blooded Americans.
 
I'm going to do something now that I rarely do (get your minds out of the gutter)- I'm going to be serious. Above all else, the one thing that I wish for my kids is that they become compassionate human beings. Treat someone else the way you would want to be treated. I have to agree with Don- much of the U.S. population would want to immediately go to war with any nation that was seen wiping their ass with pages from the bible. Wouldn't you agree?

Bonehead
 
Ok beat me to death with this one!!:confused:

I have just spent the last several hours calming the waters because a new member I brought to this forum was criticized for making a quasi "raciest statement"!
The very next thing I read is yep you Guessed IT , RIGHT HERE in all it's well meant humor and we all know that it is!! But for Christ's sake can we at least be consistent in where we apply the admonitions and the giggles and guffaws!!

I really don't give a damn who what where and how often you insult today, yesterday, or tomorrow but one of the problems you invite!! With respect to new people which you for the most part say you want and welcome is they read something and apply the same kind of thing or less elsewhere and KA BOOM there now racists or some other convenient gobbedly-gook!! Yes in some circles GOOK is a pejorative term !! Well whoopee do let's be fair and yes I'll take the heat for every damn bit of this!!!!:soapbox:

PS Doc, Junk, BC take note Please!!

Dean
 
Archdean said:
Ok beat me to death with this one!!:confused:

I have just spent the last several hours calming the waters because a new member I brought to this forum was criticized for making a quasi "raciest statement"!
The very next thing I read is yep you Guessed IT , RIGHT HERE in all it's well meant humor and we all know that it is!! But for Christ's sake can we at least be consistent in where we apply the admonitions and the giggles and guffaws!!

I really don't give a damn who what where and how often you insult today, yesterday, or tomorrow but one of the problems you invite!! With respect to new people which you for the most part say you want and welcome is they read something and apply the same kind of thing or less elsewhere and KA BOOM there now racists or some other convenient gobbedly-gook!! Yes in some circles GOOK is a pejorative term !! Well whoopee do let's be fair and yes I'll take the heat for every damn bit of this!!!!:soapbox:

PS Doc, Junk, BC take note Please!!

Dean


I guess I don't see where the inconsistencies are at. At all times, the emphasis has been on avoiding personal and/or ethical slander. In both of the subjects you pointed out, there were no giggles and guffaws, only admonition. :StickOutT
 
OkeeDon,I put a caviot at the end perhaps they can and will do a much better job for you than I can or will ever do!!

But thanks for your interest,

Dean
 
Just for the record guys; you need to get your terminology straight. What you are discussing in reference to what the Iranian president said is anti-Semitism. NOT racism. The Israeli's are NOT a race, they are an ethnic/religious group. And yes, I think some of you need to get laid! ;) :D :poke:
 
€hieƒ™ said:
Just for the record guys; you need to get your terminology straight. What you are discussing in reference to what the Iranian president said is anti-Semitism. NOT racism. The Israeli's are NOT a race, they are an ethnic/religious group. And yes, I think some of you need to get laid! ;) :D :poke:

From Wikipedia:

A race is a population of humans distinguished from other populations.

There is no such thing as a scientific definition of race, we are all Homo Sapiens Sapiens, race is a purely social construct.
 
€hieƒ™ said:
Just for the record guys; you need to get your terminology straight. What you are discussing in reference to what the Iranian president said is anti-Semitism. NOT racism...
From a quick search on the web:
---------------------------------------
Semites are peoples who speak Semitic languages; the group includes Arabs, Aramaeans, Jews, and many Ethiopians. In a Biblical sense, Semites are peoples whose ancestry can be traced back to Shem, Noah's eldest son. The ancient Semitic populations were pastoral Nomads who several centuries before the Christian Era were migrating in large numbers from Arabia to Mesopotamia, the coasts of the Mediterranean Sea, and the Nile River delta. Jews and other Semites settled in villages in Judea, southern Palestine. Present day speakers of Semitic languages are as diverse in physical, psychological, cultural, and sociological characteristics as are speakers of Indo European languages. The most prominent Semites today are Arabs and Jews. They are different in many ways, and they have absorbed a variety of European traits through centuries of migration and trade. The origin of Semitic languages, however, and many similarities in the stories of Islam and Judaism reflect a common ancient history.
--------------------------------------
It would be tough for the Iranian President to be anti-Semite, he is Semite.

Further, while Israeli's are identified by their national origin, Jews are considered to be a Race (while I agree that we are all homo sapiens, I'm using the term Race in the social sense).

A little more: "A Semite is someone descended from Shem, the eldest son of Noah. A HEBREW is someone descended from Heber (or, "Eber"), one of the great-grandsons of Shem. So all Hebrews are Semites, but not all Semites are Hebrews. (Both Sunnite Arabs and Jews are Semites, and Hebrews.)" Iranians are Sunnite.

So, as you can see, there is very little in that statement than can be agreed with.
 
Last edited:
DaveNay said:
From Wikipedia:

A race is a population of humans distinguished from other populations.

There is no such thing as a scientific definition of race, we are all Homo Sapiens Sapiens, race is a purely social construct.

Try telling that to 19% of the population of the US and brace yourself for the Likes of JJ and etc. my friend!!

It's what I have tried in earnest to have you and others see!!
I digress when indoctrinated cultures such as The mainland Chinese/North Koreans and the Upstart Muslim factions have you eating your ration of rice and playing your tunes with chopsticks while reading verses from the Koran in unison all the while wondering how in hell did this happen?
You will at least be able to give yourself an answer!!!

Re: the last two demographic informative post's::
I really hate to break this news to you , THEY COULD CARE LESS WHAT YOU THINK let-alone WHAT YOU SAY!!!

Dean
 
Archdean said:
Try telling that to 19% of the population of the US and brace yourself for the Likes of JJ and etc. my friend!!

It's what I have tried in earnest to have you and others see!!

By "JJ", I assume you are refering to Rev. Jesse Jackson? Having grown up in the Chicago area, I have seen more of Jesse Jackson than probably anyone here at FF, except Bob S. If you believe that his motivations are based on racial inequality and disparaty, then you have misunderstood. Jesse Jackson and Dr. Martin Luther King represent the elimination of the social boundries of race.

Please note, I very explicitly do not include Louis Farrakahn in this group....he is a complete nut case.

Archdean said:
I digress when indoctrinated cultures such as The mainland Chinese/North Koreans and the Upstart Muslim factions have you eating your ration of rice and playing your tunes with chopsticks while reading verses from the Koran in unison all the while wondering how in hell did this happen?
You will at least be able to give yourself an answer!!!

Wow....how very Orwellian. :smileywac

Having spent three weeks in mainland China in Sept and Oct 2001 for vacation, I can tell you with absolute certainty that Chinese citizens are exactly like everyone else. They have no secret plans to take over the world and invade your little corner of Oklahoma. They want to go to work, provide for their families, love each other and have some occasional fun. Just like you.

As for the communist Chinese government, that is somewhat of a farce as everywhere I went there was just as much free market economy in China as I have ever seen in the U.S. Are the working conditions deplorable? Yes, but they are no different than here in the 19th and early 20th centuries.

Archdean said:
Re: the last two demographic informative post's::
I really hate to break this news to you , THEY COULD CARE LESS WHAT YOU THINK let-alone WHAT YOU SAY!!!

Dean


Heh heh.....refer to my sig line for my opinion on that. :D
 
"Wow....how very Orwellian. :smileywac"

Having spent three weeks in mainland China in Sept and Oct 2001 for vacation, I can tell you with absolute certainty "

Now there is a statement that reeks of self importance !!
Ok we will go with that, and assume you are philosophically correct in your beliefs. You have just proved to me that you are without the foggiest understanding of what Cultural Indoctrination means!!

Hollywood spouts the same tripe with an or a better amount of conviction!!

I'm not in any way demeaning your post but please reread what you purportedly asked me to respond to!!

Do you somehow miss the point that most of the world will willingly kill themselves to just kill you!! Are you really that naive?? The generic you in context of course!!

Dean
 
No wonder we have the problems we do. We can raise our children to be loving and treat all men as they want to be treated and still get s**t on in the end. This is a real world and you are going to run unto those who want to take you out for you beliefs so turning the other cheeck will only work in the fictional world of socialism if everything has been done to appease thise who want to kill you. It makes no sense to me to raise girly men but do it in europe as they will have you with open arms into their social climate.

I don't believe in being a war monger but if someone wants me dead then war it will be. I can not for the life of me see why we as Americans have to turn our cheeck to get slapped by those we pull out of the missing gene pool. Just slap them down like the dogs they are. We have to stand tall and proud of what this country has accomplished and those that oppose us should be left to starve or kill one another as we are seeing in the mid east now. Terrorist are one rung below camel dung and we are asked to cow tow to there likes by a few who are flag waivers until the shit hits the fan and then want a politically correct way of handling the problem. If we dont get a handle on this arabic situation we may as well get used to the daily bombings here and the we will have a modern day holocost.....................

As for their not believing in the holocost remember we are dealing with fanatics that have been told since they were born that Jews are the scurge of the earth. Proof that most of these followers are mentally unstable and will carry out attrocities against anyone who differs in their uneducated beliefs......
 
Archdean said:
Ok beat me to death with this one!!:confused:
.......
yes I'll take the heat for every damn bit of this!!!!:soapbox:

PS Doc, Junk, BC take note Please!!

Dean

Dean, you will not take the heat for anyone other than yourself. Each adult here is responsible for themselves, period.

If someone does not like what they see as inconsistancies here, they know where the door is. This forum is a bit different than others on purpose. But as admin I have no desire to mediate between grown adults. Myself and the mods draw the lines and show what is allowed. Everyone is given the chance to obide by our minimal regulations. Respect is required, racism is not allowed. It's really as simple as that.
 
Archdean said:
Now there is a statement that reeks of self importance !!

Pot calling the kettle black comes to mind! :whistle:
 
Top