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Anybody watching Trump vs Zelinski on TV?

waybomb

waybomb

Well-known member
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Trump is telling Zelinski off. Zelinski is being an idiot if you ask me. I don't have a link. Just watching it in tv.
And then to the press idiots he sticks up for Putin because of Russia, Russia, Russia. Hunters laptop, and Biden's bullshit.
No bullshit. Zelinski blew it. He can come back when he is ready for peace.

A link to the thing.
 
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I watched. WOW and YIKES.

JD Vance was brutally honest.

Trump was harsh but honest.

"What if-ism" from the Ukraine/media side was strong but smacked down. The facts are the facts. Zelensky has the modern Oberlin or Columbia college student attitude that the world owes them everything, because they say so. Zelensky has repeatedly asked for NATO troops (we send 18 year olds into battle) but if you walk the streets of Kiev you find that soldiers are conscripted at around 30 years old? How about he start putting the 18+ year olds on the battle field before asking for our kids?

Realize we do NOT list Ukraine as a military ally. We don't have a mutual defense treaty. We do have trade pacts.

UK’s Kier Stiemer said he wanted to put 10,000 UK troops on the ground… his top general said they can’t, they have battle ready ability to put maybe 1800

BUT the top general said we need to rely on the US logistics (AC130s and similar planes) to move troops, equipment, etc

And Germany, all blustery, has a battle ready force of 10, perhaps 11, F35 fighters. 10 or 11. How is that going to help.

Where is Europe you ask? They are lined up BEHIND the US cowering and hoping we will fight their battle.

THIS IS WHY Trump has been so hard on NATO and getting nations to pay up.

THIS IS WHY Canada and another 8 nations, that are not paying their fair share, needs to cough up 10% of their GDP for defense, just to catch up to the 2% commitment they made a decade + ago.
I am not and never was a huge Trump fan. But I have to say, my optimism for PEACE in the world has been higher for the past 60+ days than ever before.

STROKE OF FUCKING GENIUS to say “I want to buy Greenland” … the Danish are now pumping 2 BILLION into defense for Greenland and 7 BILLION total in their defenses. The Danes are literally on a military spending spree.

TROLLING Governor Castro/Trudeau about making Canada a state ... LOL they are now patrolling the border and we are just getting them starting toward meeting their other obligations that they have ignored on mutual defense and NATO commitment. Understand the Canadians were, in past wars, a fierce and outsized fighting force, among the best in the world. Decimated and pussified now, just like the English forces.

NATO nations are actually starting to talk about going to 3, 4 and 5%

And GAZA . . . turn it into a resort . . . LOL, now the ball is in the Saudi, Egyptian, etc etc etc court and they have to figure out a REAL FUCKING PLAN of what to do.
 
My thoughts exactly.
Did you see Carl Rove(r) talk about it, saying this never should have been public? I think it was 100% the right thing to do to expose Zelinski for what he is.
Trump plays 3d chess.
 
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I did not see Rove. Or any other bits. Just watched in on the X and YouTube streams.

I got to say, NATO, Europe, Canada, Mexico, China, the whole of the middle east, etc are all "on notice" because Tump just issued the biggest F-A-F-O statement of the century and JD Vance was there adding in bonus points.

The world fell into complacency and there is now a new sheriff in town.
 

Hard times create strong men. ​

Strong men create good times. ​

Good times create weak men. ​

And, weak men create hard times.​

― G. Michael Hopf, THOSE WHO REMAIN​

Where do you think we are now?
 
Quite a show of diplomacy , unbelievable , probably the first for the Oval office. This matches the UN vote this week , where the U.S sided with Russia and North Korea . Will the mineral deal signing , still go ahead, just wow.....
 
This is exactly what needed to happen. Zelensky had been coddled by the Biden administration, like a spoiled child, and he came to believe he could get the U.S. to do whatever he wanted simply because Americans don't want to see Ukraine fall to Russia. That BS doesn't work anymore, not with Trump as president.

Trump is basically telling Zelensky: If you want our help to end the war, then we are dictating the terms, not you. If you've got a problem with that, enjoy getting rolled over by Russia. I'll be on the golf course.

Zelensky threw a fit and ran away, but, like a spoiled child whose just got a dose of tough love, his pouting is giving way to a new attitude. He'll be back, humbled, because he realizes now that's the only way this is going to work.
 
J5 Bombardier said:
Quite a show of diplomacy , unbelievable , probably the first for the Oval office. This matches the UN vote this week , where the U.S sided with Russia and North Korea . Will the mineral deal signing , still go ahead, just wow.....
Click to expand...

It will FINALLY go ahead.

Zelensky has been publicly sniping at Trump and the US for weeks. Like a little sparrow, just chirping away. Thinking his critical little chirps are going to make US public opinion change, thinking the tiny squawks of disapproval will change something.

This press conference was a freaking master class in diplomacy.

On one side we have the beggar king Zelensky who was making all the public criticism, on the other side we had Trump trying to do things through meetings and not criticizing Zelensky. Until it boiled over. Then Trump would blow his top.

So what is the best possible way to settle it?
TOGETHER and IN PUBLIC.
Zelensky thought it was a good idea going in so he could continue chirping.

And it backfired.

Zelensky has apologized.

We will finally see peace of some sort.


Screenshot 2025-02-28 at 1.48.21 PM.png
 
The signing if it happens is just a preamble to work out the deal , the nitty gritty will be negotiated down the road . However this plays out , after today Trump and Vance now own this , they have chosen to side with Russia in this conflict and it's a win win for Putin . But who knows , Trump could do a 180 turn tomorrow , he's that unpredictable .
 
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This entire event had nothing to do with Putin
Nothing.
It showed Zelinski for what he is. The only one going to broker any deal is Donald.
Without Donald, either Zelinski loses what he has lost, or he loses more.
Putin ain't stopping until Donald steps in. It's that simple.
The rest of NATO got nuthin.
 
The Russians are sitting back and laughing , having gained concessions from the U.S even before sitting at the table. No Nato for Ukraine , hold what land they have taken , U.S support in the UN , so Putin was given a gift . He needed it , cause his advances have slowed down , the losses of up to 1800 men a day are not sustainable .
 
J5 Bombardier said:
The signing if it happens is just a preamble to work out the deal , the nitty gritty will be negotiated down the road . However this plays out , after today Trump and Vance now own this , they have chosen to side with Russia in this conflict and it's a win win for Putin . But who knows , Trump could do a 180 turn tomorrow , he's that unpredictable .
Click to expand...
It's not a win for Putin if he's as smart as some say. Putin, if he's smart, knows that this move forces Zelensky in a corner, and the latter will come back to Trump on his knees. One must think a few moves ahead. Trump will dictate the terms, and Putin will be lucky, in the end, to keep the territory he's taken. Meanwhile, the U.S. and Ukraine will have a lucrative minerals deal that will act as a deterrent to any Russian aggression in the future.
 
J5 Bombardier said:
The Russians are sitting back and laughing , having gained concessions from the U.S even before sitting at the table. No Nato for Ukraine , hold what land they have taken , U.S support in the UN , so Putin was given a gift . He needed it , cause his advances have slowed down , the losses of up to 1800 men a day are not sustainable .
Click to expand...
Ukraine is losing a lot of soldiers as well, and they are running out of resources. If this goes on long enough, Russia will simply wear Ukraine down. Ukraine's only option is to sue for peace while they still have most of their country intact. Putin would prefer the war to go on.
 
Patriot said:
Ukraine is losing a lot of soldiers as well, and they are running out of resources. If this goes on long enough, Russia will simply wear Ukraine down. Ukraine's only option is to sue for peace while they still have most of their country intact. Putin would prefer the war to go on.
Click to expand...
The Ukrainians won't sign a deal without solid guarantees that they will be protected when Putin comes back for round two. They know the Russians can't be trusted , which when the U.S. stops aid , will the Europeans take up the slack. If not , then the option of "letting the genie out of the bottle " , which many of these countries will be considering for their own safety. Crude but usable short range Nuclear weapons to keep the Russians at bay , pretty scary stuff.
 
There won't be any nukes.
There won't be any NATO.
Ukraine will give up some of what Russia took.
If Zelinski doesn't agree now, he'll lose alot more.
And there will be a much larger NATO and a new US presence on the Polish border.
And Putin does not want that.
 
J5 Bombardier said:
The Ukrainians won't sign a deal without solid guarantees that they will be protected when Putin comes back for round two. They know the Russians can't be trusted , which when the U.S. stops aid , will the Europeans take up the slack. If not , then the option of "letting the genie out of the bottle " , which many of these countries will be considering for their own safety. Crude but usable short range Nuclear weapons to keep the Russians at bay , pretty scary stuff.
Click to expand...
Why would the USA stop aid? Thats not in the deal. What has stopped is the cash laundry operation. An operation that Zilinsky and friends currently enjoy.

If the US interests have huge investments in mining and transport of minerals from Ukraine, then two things happen. The US will protect it's interests and Russia will have no choice but to cease hostilities.

Ukraine has lost more than 90 thousand lives, not to mention irreplicable real-estate and treasured structures. In the process making Zelinsky and other oligarchs uber rich. Time for him to retire.
 
J5 Bombardier said:
The Ukrainians won't sign a deal without solid guarantees that they will be protected when Putin comes back for round two. They know the Russians can't be trusted , which when the U.S. stops aid , will the Europeans take up the slack. If not , then the option of "letting the genie out of the bottle " , which many of these countries will be considering for their own safety. Crude but usable short range Nuclear weapons to keep the Russians at bay , pretty scary stuff.
Click to expand...
The Russians can't be trusted, that's true, but that's baked into the cake. We are offering Ukraine a way to give the U.S. more of a vested interest in the integrity of that country beyond just sympathy. If we make a lucrative rare earth mineral deal, then we have more of a stake in the game. Yes, we gain from that, but Ukraine gains much more, namely, an end to war and death on their soil.

Zelensky will come hat in hand back to the table, because if he doesn't, Trump, and an increasing segment of the American population, are on the verge of saying "screw you, ask Europe for help, because we're tired of wasting our treasure on defending you."

Europe doesn't want that, because this is on their doorstep, and they'd be forced to pony up. The events of today guarantee that Zelensky will sign the deal, and the war will end.
 
Patriot said:
The Russians can't be trusted, that's true, but that's baked into the cake. We are offering Ukraine a way to give the U.S. more of a vested interest in the integrity of that country beyond just sympathy. If we make a lucrative rare earth mineral deal, then we have more of a stake in the game. Yes, we gain from that, but Ukraine gains much more, namely, an end to war and death on their soil.

Zelensky will come hat in hand back to the table, because if he doesn't, Trump, and an increasing segment of the American population, are on the verge of saying "screw you, ask Europe for help, because we're tired of wasting our treasure on defending you."

Europe doesn't want that, because this is on their doorstep, and they'd be forced to pony up. The events of today guarantee that Zelensky will sign the deal, and the war will end.
Click to expand...
The question is will Europe "pony up" , as it stands right now Nato is at a watershed , possible broken , maybe for only 4 years , maybe Trump will pull out of Nato , either way things will change and the alliance will have to adapt , or morph into some European led defence force
No signature as of today , but probably down the road , but it is hard to see how American interests in the minerals will be secured with no presence in the country and some of these deposits in Russian controlled Ukraine .Will Foreign investment come into the country , if a tentative peace does come , or an operational pause in the Russian view to rebuild their army .
As for Polls take with a grain of salt ,but one in feb 2025 has 81% of Americans not trusting Putin , probably the right call.
 
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Ukraine is destroyed. Demoralized and broke. But the leadership, safe from the war has prospered.
Do not forget, Zelensky supported his benefactors Biden/Harris against Trump.
Why do you suppose he did that?
Because of the money.

This has nothing to do with peace in the region.

Perhaps President Trump did not include enough graft in the proposed, and originally ratified, deal.
 
FrancSevin said:
Ukraine is destroyed. Demoralized and broke. But the leadership, safe from the war has prospered.
Do not forget, Zelensky supported his benefactors Biden/Harris against Trump.
Why do you suppose he did that?
Because of the money.

This has nothing to do with peace in the region.

Perhaps President Trump did not include enough graft in the proposed, and originally ratified, deal.
Click to expand...
I think you really hit on something there. It does really seem that Zelensky is not exactly eager to end the war that has taken so many of his citizens' lives. The idea that he wants the war to keep going is absolutely disgusting to contemplate, but it also makes sense.

However, even Zelensky will have to play ball if he feels that his own ass is on the line. If Russia were to take Ukraine, Zelensky would either have to flee the country, get killed, or get captured (and probably killed later).

So, his likely strategy is just to keep the war going, but to also keep the money and material flowing to him, so he can make a show of fighting the Russians and keeping them from winning any time soon.
 
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