Thiokol 601

[weatherby]

Thanks for the reply, after looking into the snocat a little more I am told it has a ford 6cly motor and auto transmission. So it looks like it was upgraded along the way at some point.

We would like to see more pics if possible, If you check out my thread on my restore of my 601, you will learn a lot.

 

[crafttree]

I found the ID tag in the front of the cab and it says 4t10 made in 1962. It has a c5 ford 3 speed auto trans and an oc-15 rear end. The bogey drive wheel looks like the ones on the 601. Sorry the pics are not the best.

601 or 4t10?

 

[Mainer]

It's a 4T10, highly modified.
You see there are no axles... and hence it is not a 601.
The way the OC-15 is fitted, it shows it is not stock.
The tracks are 601. The OC-15 is obviously 601.
The transmission is neither 4T10 or 601. Sprockets are 601.
I've never seen a conversion like this. Machine itself looks to be in nice shape and the conversion looks to be quite good.... the axle-less design of the 4T10 is most likely weaker than the 601 yet gives you clearances.
Clearly a mixed bag... the most valuable piece of that conversion are the OC-15 and the tracks. If in nice condition, the OC-15 is worth about $8K (the lighter OC-12 is about $4K). The tracks are worth about $4-5K if also in similar condition...which they look from the photos.
Whadya think? Pick it up for $6K? Good you're asking questions... but buy it before someone else does as there are certainly people hunting for it as you contemplate it. It's a hybrid... it's a great conversoin... it's a stupid-good price if it's running. Your decision should be made.

 

[crafttree]

You are right, I am not at all familiar with the under carriage of this machine. could you explain what I am looking at in this pic of the under carriage?

Dick

 

[weatherby]

Yes...It is definitely a 4T10 that somebody has morphed into a 601. One other "quick" way to identify a 4t10 from a 601 is 4t10s have the wiper motors above the windshield, unlike a 601 that have the wiper motors below the windshield.

It still "may" be worth 6000.00 "IF" it was done correctly.

 

[crafttree]

The machine has snowcraft stickers on the doors so I assume they did the mod. Know much about them?

 

[weatherby]

The machine has snowcraft stickers on the doors so I assume they did the mod. Know much about them?

No ..never heard of them!

 

[weatherby]

Here is a pic of a 601 frame & axles

 

[weatherby]

Sorry I forgot the pic in the last post, so here it is

 

[Mainer]

It still "may" be worth 6000.00 "IF" it was done correctly.

Yea, very good point and advice.

Crafttree----In terms of history and mods... as you'd imagine, once people start to muck with the machines... ya never know..some are done beautifully and others... Even maintaining a standard machine is quite poorly done, let alone one with significant modifications.

Personally, the 4T10's are often misunderstood ... like the one you have found, it's the original cab design and the predecessor to the 601 that this one is made out to be...

See the below... this was the design of what this machine was... schematic and photo of the back-end 4T. Also you will see sprocket variations between 4T's and 6's and also track style differences between 4T10 (with wheel guides) and 601.

Subtle nuances that we are all so very passionate about. 8)

 

[crafttree]

Since I don't know a good mod from a poor one, are there some things I should look for that might give me some clues as to how well the job was done?

 

[Snowtrac Nome]

Since I don't know a good mod from a poor one, are there some things I should look for that might give me some clues as to how well the job was done?

as far as mods go do do items used to addapt stuff look factory or did they use addaptors cut out ometal witha torch and your second clue should be welding are the beads uniforn and looking like pennys laied down or do they look like bird terds of full of pin holes 3 rd thing is routing of pipes hoses and wiring harnesses are they laied out nicely with no chafing or rubbing or do they look added on an run haphazzardly.

 

[weatherby]

Since I don't know a good mod from a poor one, are there some things I should look for that might give me some clues as to how well the job was done?

I wish I could look at it in person for you, because without physically looking at it, It's nearly impossible to assume the mods on this cat were done correctly or incorrectly. The best we can do on this site is answer any questions that you have. One thing that I did notice, in your pic of the dash, it shows the Master switch in the ON position and the Tach. reading about 2800 RPM, unless somebody was revving the engine, the normal idle rpm should be around 700 rpm, and if the engine "was" idling normal when that pic was taken, then the tach is not reading correctly.

 

[Snowtrac Nome]

I wish I could look at it in person for you, because without physically looking at it, It's nearly impossible to assume the mods on this cat were done correctly or incorrectly. The best we can do on this site is answer any questions that you have. One thing that I did notice, in your pic of the dash, it shows the Master switch in the ON position and the Tach. reading about 2800 RPM, unless somebody was revving the engine, the normal idle rpm should be around 700 rpm, and if the engine "was" idling normal when that pic was taken, then the tach is not reading correctly.

ihave seen some electronic tachs jump when the power is shut off don't ask me why but i have seen both aftermarket and oem do that on certin cars.

 

[mtncrawler]

Question I have is how many guys have PM'ed you with the idea that "if you're not real interested I'd sure appreciate it if you'd give me the phone number" routine. Haven't seen a 601 or a Trackmaster hit the open market for a while now.

 

[Mainer]

I echo that question as well... awww heck... I'm guilty of that and not ashamed for a second. I'll also say... that it never actually has worked for me either! Seems that anyone that actually gets 'involved' with a TM/601 ... well... it's usually love at first sight and that's all she wrote!
Hey, it's an unparalleled high-demand super performing model of machine! No comments from the 'powder-puff' lightweight cat peanut gallery.... proof is simply in the pudding guys... they get snapped up lightning fast and people clammer and hunt high-and-low for them... and when you see the Weatherby rebuild... it just makes it not only all that much more attractive... but that much more doable as he's created the 'bible' for not only 601 concours show-grade restoration...but general restoration of a Thiokol machine.

 

[crafttree]

The tach is apparently stuck at 2800. No batteries in it at present. The ignition switch was left on. Going to see if I can get it started today.
Is there a good pic posted some where of a 4t10 with the cab removed so I can see what it looks like with out any mods. I plan on crawling under it to day to see what all was done.
You are right I love looks of this cat. Wish I had the $ to do a frame up restoration.
With so many 601 mods to it I am not sure what to call it.
I plan on replacing tires,
bearings and seals. I suspect the brake bands need to be redone and the brake steer hydrolics gone thru.
I don't know much about the suspension on the 4t10, not sure what needs to be done there.
I am sure this will be an adventure, and I'll be asking lots of questions.

 

[weatherby]

I don't think a pic of a 4T10 undercarriage as ever been posted, (at least since 2006) but I will see what I can find.
You ask all the questions you want, there is a lot of knowledge on this site about these Thiokol 4T10 and 601s and they would be more than happy to try and help you any way they can. Also, (there is no such thing as a stupid question on this site).

 

[Snowtrac Nome]

I don't think a pic of a 4T10 undercarriage as ever been posted, (at least since 2006) but I will see what I can find.
You ask all the questions you want, there is a lot of knowledge on this site about these Thiokol 4T10 and 601s and they would be more than happy to try and help you any way they can. Also, (there is no such thing as a stupid question on this site).

you forgot about one question is a krusty better than snow tracs or thiokols

 

[weatherby]

you forgot about one question is a krusty better than snow tracs or thiokols

I think we all know how I would answer that question

 

[crafttree]

Here is a pic of the mods around the c6 auto trans. I fired it up today, ran great, and will load it on a trailer tomorrow and bring that sweet thing home. will post some more pics as I go

 

[Mainer]

Although there are several 600's around with the auto tranny upgrade... this is the first ever posted photo of the guts. Keep those pics high-resolution please so we can enjoy the details! Keep 'em coming. Once you get in there, a thorough photo shoot around mounting brackets, etc. would be interesting... you should be able to tell alot based on how well some of the gear has been mounted...OC-15, tranny, etc...

 

[Mainer]

...Is there a good pic posted some where of a 4t10 with the cab removed so I can see what it looks like with out any mods. I plan on crawling under it to day to see what all was done....

Like Weatherby, I've never seen a pure untouched 4T10 tub photo... these are the closest I've seen from a forum member...diff was changed to a Bombi diff... not too high res.

I think there may be some very nice 4T10 tub photos in process from one of the forum member with a T10 in process...that will be going under the knife soon...but before it does, certainly some very hi-res photos will be taken.

 

[Snowtrac Nome]

i liked the 4t suspension that was posted further back resembles the christi suspension of the early russian tanks like the t34

 

[crafttree]

Here are smoe better pics of the mods on the 4t10.
Can the tracks be removed by just using the track clamps or does the track tension adjuster have to be backed off a little too?

 

[crafttree]

a few more pics

 

[weatherby]

To remove your tracks, you can probably just use the track jacks, however, when installing the tracks, you should adjust the track adjusters all the way back, it will make it all that much easier to bring the track ends together.

 

[crafttree]

Loading up and heading home, gonna be fun

 

[Snowtrac Nome]

i like the drain plug mod added to the oil pan you should always change the filter to but the drain plug makes the job neet and clean

 

[Mainer]

Greeeat photos! Really luv the blow-by-blow... looks like a great machine. Nice and neat and nicely accessorized. I like the color...haven't seen one this color before... I've seen a couple dark green units that were forestry units. Some Army tan, Army green, etc... but not this sage color that blends like a chameleon to the landscape. If the mods of the tranny and OC-15 were done well... properly aligned, etc... then you got a great machine & deal there!