The costs of the 'War on Drugs'

[Greatest I am]

t might be wise to check the progress of things in areas where "medical" drugs have been legalized. The first parts of traffic problems are turning up and it appears that it is difficult to prove as there is no easy field test for intoxication. The next step will be employers who have employees who need and use their "medications" at work and don't even think that won't happen.....

Thanks for the fear mongering. Anyone with half a brain will see your reply as the deflection that it is.

You shy away from the many more instances where the status quo policies of governments create more problems than they solve as is exemplified in the drug issue. They legalize the most dangerous and make the more benign drugs illegal.

That insanity is part of the issue and as it is the main part of the O P in the sense that not being so foolish with our drug policies, the cost in $$$, and more importantly, lives. Not just of those who are killed by the use and abuse of all drugs, but also our soldiers that are dying for drug wars, without being told, that wars of prohibition have never worked, without curtailing the freedom that we are supposed to represent.

Further, governments are the drug trade.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

Sounds to me like you are a toker, and want an impairment drug legalized, on top of the legal ones. A logic failure at best, probably a result of blowing too much bad smoke.

You are directing that at every major report done in the last 110 years.
I have read them. Have you?

Thanks for your expert opinion.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

"In this case, the law is just there to discriminate without just cause"

no, that says "why can't i smoke pot...WAAAAaaa"

btw, he's posted no studies, nothing to back up his facts (as he sees them)

My views wil match the general direction referenced in the LeDain Royal Commission report. That particular study and todays reality are the same.

It's general stance was away from the policing and criminal aspects, and more into the medical aspects. We are moving that way but too slowly.

By the way, children will say WAAAAaaa.
You show your age.

Men will say something like-------

"First they came for the Jews, but I did nothing because I'm not a Jew. Then they came for the socialists, but I did nothing because I'm not a socialist. Then they came for the Catholics, but I did nothing because I'm not a Catholic. Finally, they came for me, but by then there was no one left to help me." – Pastor Father Niemoller (1946)”

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

Killing animals with guns is legal, so why not people? You could buy a license to kill the sunuvabitch that's bothering you, camouflage up, Load your weapon, and pop hiz azz full of lead. What the heck, you paid the tax. And it's only killing a mammal.

Same argument as alcohol is legal, so make marijuana legal. While at it, make LSD legal, make psilocibin legal. Yellow jackets too. We could legalize and tax all sorts of good fun drugs. We could charge more tax for hallucinogenics.

So what you rather do, drive down the road with oncoming traffic possibly being boozed up, or a whole bunch of cars drivin by heads?

Heads.

You might have a point your way though.
If it were boozers they might not get as far as you are.
Ahh. If they just did not take out so many innocent lives with them.

Regards
DL

 

[Catavenger]

Wow the great one quoting a pastor amazing! What is even more amazing is that I agree with him (at least in some areas) re: medical marijuana. People with epilepsy who have uncrontrolled seizures are not allowed to drive. So I would not worry about them using marijuana and getting behind the wheel. I think medical marijuana for some people with some conditions should be legal.

 

[rback33]

Wow the great one quoting a pastor amazing! What is even more amazing is that I agree with him (at least in some areas) re: medical marijuana. People with epilepsy who have uncrontrolled seizures are not allowed to drive. So I would not worry about them using marijuana and getting behind the wheel. I think medical marijuana for some people with some conditions should be legal.

I agree. I have never smoked pot. I have been around pot being smoked, but never tried it. That said.... people I know that do or have smoke it, say that it would be the BEST thing I could do for my anxiety. If it was legal, I would try. Keep in mind, I don't smoke period. I don't know how many of you have dealt with severe anxiety issues, but they are not fun. If I miss my meds for some reason, I feel it. It sucks. Sucks so bad I would try weed to counteract it. Until it's legalized I sit here and wait... who knows... it might not help me at all, but I would like the option to try it...

 

[NorthernRedneck]

Since we're talking about the "war on drugs", what are your thoughts on prescription drugs being used for purposes other than what they were intended? (question directed at no one in particular)

As I've said before in other threads, I work in social services. One of the reoccuring problems we see with allot of the families we work with is the use of prescription pills such as oxycontins, ritallin and percecets. Working with the natives up here, it's clear that prescription drugs are a major problem because they are readily available. The problem has gotten way out of hand to the point where the Chiefs and Elders I talk to identify that the problem is no longer alcohol or marijuana but is now prescription medications because they are so readily available. The problem gets worse when you combine the prescription medications with alcohol or marijuana. And this happens allot. The use of marijuana by itself is bad enough alone but when you combine it with alcohol and prescription medications, now you've got a real problem on your hands.

I'm not about to dig up scripture to prove my point. I see it every day working with children who have been abandoned by their parents because of marijuana, alcohol, and prescription medications. It sickens me to think that people want to legalize the stuff just so they can get a quick buzz every now and then. I'm sorry but when I walk in and find a 1 yr old baby who hasn't been fed or changed in over 24 hrs because their parents are stoned out of their mind and passed out from drinking, there's no excuse in the world that would convince me that we should just legalize the stuff and all the worlds problems will go away.

People seem to always have a narrow mind when it comes to social services. They think that we're only there to take the kids away if the parents try to discipline them. That's far from the truth. Reality is that the majority of the cases we deal with are because of inadequate supervision due to the parents being intoxicated by either drugs, alcohol, or prescription medications.

 

[SShepherd]

My views wil match the general direction referenced in the LeDain Royal Commission report. That particular study and todays reality are the same.

It's general stance was away from the policing and criminal aspects, and more into the medical aspects. We are moving that way but too slowly.

By the way, children will say WAAAAaaa.
You show your age.

Men will say something like-------

"First they came for the Jews, but I did nothing because I'm not a Jew. Then they came for the socialists, but I did nothing because I'm not a socialist. Then they came for the Catholics, but I did nothing because I'm not a Catholic. Finally, they came for me, but by then there was no one left to help me." – Pastor Father Niemoller (1946)”

Regards
DL

ah, a condecending toker at that. Yet another poor attempt at an insult.
You sure like to use "we" and "us", but I see you're from another country- don't include me in a group of "you".

Funny, and as usuall you quote whatever suits your fancy- yet again you contradict yourself.
You really do seem like a person who spends alot of time alone-because you have a very odd sence of reality and facts. I knew a person from newfoundland that acted the same way.

 

[SShepherd]

Wow the great one quoting a pastor amazing! What is even more amazing is that I agree with him (at least in some areas) re: medical marijuana. People with epilepsy who have uncrontrolled seizures are not allowed to drive. So I would not worry about them using marijuana and getting behind the wheel. I think medical marijuana for some people with some conditions should be legal.

I've said it before, I have no problem with people who have a medical necessity for marijuana. I agree with your statements.

 

[loboloco]

Since we're talking about the "war on drugs", what are your thoughts on prescription drugs being used for purposes other than what they were intended? (question directed at no one in particular)

As I've said before in other threads, I work in social services. One of the reoccuring problems we see with allot of the families we work with is the use of prescription pills such as oxycontins, ritallin and percecets. Working with the natives up here, it's clear that prescription drugs are a major problem because they are readily available. The problem has gotten way out of hand to the point where the Chiefs and Elders I talk to identify that the problem is no longer alcohol or marijuana but is now prescription medications because they are so readily available. The problem gets worse when you combine the prescription medications with alcohol or marijuana. And this happens allot. The use of marijuana by itself is bad enough alone but when you combine it with alcohol and prescription medications, now you've got a real problem on your hands.

I'm not about to dig up scripture to prove my point. I see it every day working with children who have been abandoned by their parents because of marijuana, alcohol, and prescription medications. It sickens me to think that people want to legalize the stuff just so they can get a quick buzz every now and then. I'm sorry but when I walk in and find a 1 yr old baby who hasn't been fed or changed in over 24 hrs because their parents are stoned out of their mind and passed out from drinking, there's no excuse in the world that would convince me that we should just legalize the stuff and all the worlds problems will go away.

People seem to always have a narrow mind when it comes to social services. They think that we're only there to take the kids away if the parents try to discipline them. That's far from the truth. Reality is that the majority of the cases we deal with are because of inadequate supervision due to the parents being intoxicated by either drugs, alcohol, or prescription medications.

Groomer, you people have a rough job. I disagree with the abuse of any substance. Marijuana should be legal for use just like alcohol, with similar penalties for abuse. Prescription meds, well, blame the docs, the politicians, the parents and the schools. All toss drugs around like there are no consequences and then wonder why little Tommy is zoned out on Ridalin.

 

[Greatest I am]

Good points.

In a legalized system, all drugs would be doled out via a prescription method that is more of a monitoring tool than one of control. Only in this way can the proof by the numbers be ascertained as to the final profits and loses. It will be a medical decision. Not a legal one.

The overall system gains just by putting pot and coke in the legal mix. Death statistics plunge.

The drug war is lost because it should never have been fought.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

I've said it before, I have no problem with people who have a medical necessity for marijuana. I agree with your statements.

Can any name an instance where the prohibition of any drug has worked?

We cannot even enforce the laws against slavery and murder yet some think we can prohibit a substance that has more than a strong foot hold within our society.

Get serious please.
The trend is to legalize and it will continue.
Especially as people realize that it is all already in the control of governments and their handlers.

Regards
DL

 

[NorthernRedneck]

Groomer, you people have a rough job. I disagree with the abuse of any substance. Marijuana should be legal for use just like alcohol, with similar penalties for abuse. Prescription meds, well, blame the docs, the politicians, the parents and the schools. All toss drugs around like there are no consequences and then wonder why little Tommy is zoned out on Ridalin.

To clarify the issues that we are facing. Yes, the docs prescribe the medications. They are legal. Then let's say John gets his LEGAL prescription and then sells the bottle of pills to Paul for say $100. Paul opens up the bottle containing 30 pills and sells them at $20 a pill to George. Now Peter down the street has a prescription for medical marijuana. He gets his prescription filled then sells the pot to George who just dished out money for the prescription drugs. Now, George has his legal prescription pills and his legal pot. He goes to buy his legal bottle of alcohol. He goes home and pops the pill, lights up a dubee, pours himself a glass, and drowns away his sorrows. Now, his kids are in the next room. His wife joins in on the fun. Who is there to watch the kids while George and his wife get stoned, drugged up, and drunk all at the same time?

This is a situation that occurs all too often and I just don't see how making the stuff more readily available is gonna help the situation.

 

[Greatest I am]

To clarify the issues that we are facing. Yes, the docs prescribe the medications. They are legal. Then let's say John gets his LEGAL prescription and then sells the bottle of pills to Paul for say $100. Paul opens up the bottle containing 30 pills and sells them at $20 a pill to George. Now Peter down the street has a prescription for medical marijuana. He gets his prescription filled then sells the pot to George who just dished out money for the prescription drugs. Now, George has his legal prescription pills and his legal pot. He goes to buy his legal bottle of alcohol. He goes home and pops the pill, lights up a dubee, pours himself a glass, and drowns away his sorrows. Now, his kids are in the next room. His wife joins in on the fun. Who is there to watch the kids while George and his wife get stoned, drugged up, and drunk all at the same time?

This is a situation that occurs all too often and I just don't see how making the stuff more readily available is gonna help the situation.

Anecdotal renderings are always so interesting.
Your example of an person who wishes to be intoxicated is going to get in whatever condition he wants regardless of what you do.

Under a legal and controlled system, our friend will do as you wish and spend more time at home, thanks to the one stop shop for drugs world that we will eventually have.

Note the improvement of the medical method as opposed to the police method.

As to any increase in intoxication. No. Just more live people.

Regards
DL

 

[SShepherd]

Can any name an instance where the prohibition of any drug has worked?

We cannot even enforce the laws against slavery and murder yet some think we can prohibit a substance that has more than a strong foot hold within our society.

Get serious please.
The trend is to legalize and it will continue.
Especially as people realize that it is all already in the control of governments and their handlers.

Regards
DL

you talk about slavery and tell me to get serious? You're irrational.