Irresponsible!

[XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq]

If I may step in (it) here: This may be obvious, but guns/gun control is one of the many topics that people will argue about passionately and yet no one is going to change their mind. I don't have to worry about that, I have no mind. :Whacky_To
Bone

Nope - sorry Bone - no stepping in! You paramedic types have to wait until the fight is over. I'm just getting warmed up!

 

[BoneheadNW]

Yes - someone touched a nerve with me!

Check out these stats on Canada's Incarceration rate:

http://bpoc.blogspot.com/2005/12/guns-effectiveness-of-registry.html

Percentage of Murderers Imprisoned (does not take multiple murders into account)

2000 - 18%
2001 - 25.6%
2002 - 22.2%
2003 - 19.1%

Favorite quote from this site:

"perhaps if you ban crime altogether, that will help........"

I'm not sure what your point is. What is your point? How do the stats for the good ol U S of A look?
Bonehead

 

[BoneheadNW]

Nope - sorry Bone - no stepping in! You paramedic types have to wait until the fight is over. I'm just getting warmed up!

I'M NOT A PARMAMEDIC! Firefighter, YES. EMT, YES. Paramedic, NO! Between you and my parents (they make the same mistake), you'll drive me nuts!
Bone

 

[XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq]

I'M NOT A PARMAMEDIC! Firefighter, YES. EMT, YES. Paramedic, NO! Between you and my parents (they make the same mistake), you'll drive me nuts!
Bone

What was that? Ambulance Driver?

 

[Melensdad]

PB . . . I think Bone is trying to tell you that he is something like a cross between a bus driver and a nurse's aid. I really wonder what THAT uniform looks like!

 

[XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq]

I'm not sure what your point is. What is your point? How do the stats for the good ol U S of A look?
Bonehead

My point is that Canada isn't doing the greatest job of putting their murderers in jail.

I did find this:

In 2002, 69% of all felons convicted in State courts were sentenced to a period of confinement - 41% to State prisons and 28% to local jails. Jail sentences are for short-term confinement (usually for a year or less) in a county or city facility, while prison sentences are for long-term confinement (usually for over a year) in a State facility.

From:
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/sent.htm

It appears that the US has a higher incarceration rate.

US statistics look pretty good over the last few years:

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance.htm#cptrends

One thing that is often overlooked in comparing the countries is just how small the population of Canada is. I think Canada has the population of California or less than that. This population is spread out over a land mass bigger than the US (although most live in the lower 200 "warm" miles of the country). Keeping this in consideration the actual "density" of the US population in comparison is much higher and should result in the US having an even higher crime rate than Canada. But that is just my perspective.

 

[dzalphakilo]

I only know the "facts" as posted here per this topic (same thing I heard on the news today other than the gun "accidently" went off, how without the boys finger on the trigger I'm not sure).

Of course I could be wrong, but some odds on the "facts" per this story

Gun was probably illegal
Most likely the only gun in the house
no "safe" form of storage for the gun
parents most likely only have a high school education
boy in question probably never took a firearms class
boy probably pissed his pants when the gun went off

Close to the same story happened here in Winston a year or so ago. From what I remember, it was the grandfatahers gun. Grandfather was charge for having a weapon readialy (ap?) available to a minor. Funny that didn't make "headline" news.

Could be wrong, but I think most states have a law pertaining to letting a minor have access to a handgun (without adult supervision).

 

[dzalphakilo]

I only know the "facts" as posted here per this topic (same thing I heard on the news today other than the gun "accidently" went off, how without the boys finger on the trigger I'm not sure).

Of course I could be wrong, but some odds on the "facts" per this storyQUOTE]

John Linwood Hall Sr.
Afro American
Numerous firearms in the apartment
Numerous arrests dating back to the 60's
could face felony charges for possesion (sp?) of a firearm

Germantown Md seems like an "interesting" (sp?) place.

 

[BoneheadNW]

PB . . . I think Bone is trying to tell you that he is something like a cross between a bus driver and a nurse's aid. I really wonder what THAT uniform looks like!

The correct term for my uniform is candy striper, and it can be found here:Bonehead's Uniform . Unfortunately, the stockings get caught up in my leg hair.
Bonehead

 

[bczoom]

Nope - sorry Bone - no stepping in! You paramedic types have to wait until the fight is over. I'm just getting warmed up!

BH,

I interpreted this post by PB to mean that we would like you (as an EMT) to join in the fray after all the fighting is done. As in real life incidents, it's not expected for you to join in the fray while the situation is still hot.

 

[beds]

Yes, I was implying that if there are more cars per capita, there will be more car accidents. I am familiar with the statistics for my London ON community where there are alot of knives used in armed assaults and few guns. Really. Less guns used than knives. Based on this, I have made an assumption that the felons are not necessarily all packin'. This may be different nationwide and certainly would be different in Vancouver or Toronto.

The CBC reports: Canada's rate is 0.5 homicides involving guns per 100,000 population, versus 3.8 per 100,000 in the States.

http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes/realitycheck/violent_crime.html

I am not declaring Canada better. This is the life that I am used to having grown up here.

 

[beds]

And speaking of facts, the "50% higher violent crime rate" is inaccurate, ultra-right-wing crap. I say that because these people published these results either without due diligence or knowing that they were putting a spin on the stats. Our violent crime rate includes all kinds of assault - what we call level 1-3. This includes slapping people, calling them names or pushing them to the ground.

http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/legal02.htm

And your sexual assault rate only includes forcible intercourse while ours is more broad. I couldn't find anything more than this to substantiate this claim:
http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/LibraryReport_PrairieCrimeFollowUp_2005_04_20.doc

I voted for Harper, and I'm glad we have him.

 

[XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq]

And speaking of facts, the "50% higher violent crime rate" is inaccurate, ultra-right-wing crap. I say that because these people published these results either without due diligence or knowing that they were putting a spin on the stats. Our violent crime rate includes all kinds of assault - what we call level 1-3. This includes slapping people, calling them names or pushing them to the ground.

http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/legal02.htm

And your sexual assault rate only includes forcible intercourse while ours is more broad. I couldn't find anything more than this to substantiate this claim:
http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/LibraryReport_PrairieCrimeFollowUp_2005_04_20.doc

I voted for Harper, and I'm glad we have him.

<WARNING! - LONG DIATRIBE BELOW/>

Hi Beds. First off - thank you for voting for Harper. I hope he can bring some honesty to Canadian politics.

Your claim that the people publishing my statistics are "ultra-right wing" could also be made about your use of the CBC statistics. In my opinion the CBC is largely an ultra-left wing news organization that couldn't exist without it's tax subsidies from the government and anti-competitive policies of the CRTC.

I will grant you that the use of statistics from disparate sources is not something that will make any argument successful.

I would argue that London, Ontario is most likely a pretty nice "college town" and that the safety and security you see would be representative of similar locations in the USA.

However, just as in the US if you were to venture into some of the lower income communities of Canada you would see many similarities in the types of crimes to similar locations in the US.

My key point is that the two countries are EXTREMELY similar. The anti-US rhetoric and smug arrogance that many Canadians have towards the US is just so much BS that it makes me very angry.

As for the NRA, if you look closely at their mandate and what they are trying to do you will see that it is a highly principled organization. They support politicians from both parties that support the second amendment. It just happens that a proportionately larger amount of these politicians tend to be republicans. The NRA is responible for lots of safety, educational, and law enforment supporting activities too. They are not extreme and I have seen little evidence of them (at the official level) trying to enforce other non-second amendment related causes. They are big and influential because they represent something that is important to a majority of the population in the US. Even my Noam Chomsky loving, Bush-hating, Democrat co-worker is a member of the NRA because he likes guns and doesn't want his freedoms taken away from him.

However, I left Canada 8 years ago and have no desire to return at this time. I find life in the US to be very rewarding and the personal freedoms, liberties, and opportunities that the US provides to be far more than anything I ever saw in Canada but that is my opinion and personal experience. As for my personal safety, I feel much safer in the US knowing that I can defend myself and my property and not have to rely on underpaid civil servants for my personal security.

I still like Canada and return there often to visit family and friends. I do find that the media in Canada and the culture in Canada is highly slanted against the US. Your views and opinions towards the US are contstantly being influenced by subtle propaganda fed to you by the news organizations in Canada.

It is disheartening to hear the anti-US information that is fed to my elementary school level nephew and niece by their teachers. With this level of early indoctrination there is little hope for improvements in the future of Canada-US relations.

I get to spend this weekend telling my 10 year old Canadian nephew about the good things that the US is doing in Iraq and explaining how all the stuff he hears in school is wrong. I also get to show him how to shoot guns responsibly without having to notify my local police that I want to drive 5 miles with my guns to a shooting range. In fact, I'm probably just going to drive over to the state owned land and shoot where everyone else around here shoots.

The weather is better down here too!

My challenge to you is to look beyond the rhetoric you are fed by the government run media organizations and propaganda machines. Look at the similarities between the countries before you look at the disimilarities. With a clear view you will see more things to enjoy about the US than to bash.

PB

 

[Melensdad]

Funny thing about the NRA bashers, I have never seen one prove that the NRA lied about anything!

The fact of the matter is that the NRA is credible simply because it has not been caught pushing lies. It simply cannot afford to lie because it would be slaughtered by the press and the anti-gun crowd. So what you see said about the NRA is typically emotionally based hogwash . . . things like gun toting zealots and hillbilly gun nuts. The reality is that the NRA is made up of union members, doctors, business executives, minimum wage workers, lawyers, teachers, police officers and many other typcial Americans.

beds . . . you are certainly welcome to your opinions, but it would be nice if you didn't insult us with broadspoken lies.

 

[Spiffy1]

I know for a fact that the firearm training I recalled came straight from my youth....not some "NRA Propoganda Manual". Coincidentally, my parents weren't NRA; never worried about.

I'm sure that Danny can say the same about his post on training his kids.

As Bob said the NRA can't afford to be spinning tales: it would backfire sooner than they could get them out. I am a member, and while I personally wish times where such that they could focus less on politics, it seems the "anti 2nd amendment advocates" can get away with propoganda, so the NRA is welcome to count my head for politics too.

 

[beds]

The NRA deserves its power - it knows how to lobby and how to rally its supporters. I'm not sure what I have stated as a broadspoken lie. Any unsubtantiated statements have the caveat of "I think" or "in my opinion".

I also do not want to besmirch any American. I do not agree with some policies and governing but I respect America and know that we can only be as free as we are in Canada because you exist. I don't feel that Iraq should have been occuppied, I don't like guns in general, I don't like welfare states or too much government and my favourite beer is made in the USA. These are all opinions of mine. They may not agree with yours, and can be the topic of conversation, but they are currently mine and I feel entitled to them.

 

[XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq]

The NRA deserves its power - it knows how to lobby and how to rally its supporters. I'm not sure what I have stated as a broadspoken lie. Any unsubtantiated statements have the caveat of "I think" or "in my opinion".

I also do not want to besmirch any American. I do not agree with some policies and governing but I respect America and know that we can only be as free as we are in Canada because you exist. I don't feel that Iraq should have been occuppied, I don't like guns in general, I don't like welfare states or too much government and my favourite beer is made in the USA. These are all opinions of mine. They may not agree with yours, and can be the topic of conversation, but they are currently mine and I feel entitled to them.

Well said beds! Except for the part on American beer? WTF?

I'd take a canadian, german or dutch beer over an american beer any day!

 

[ddrane2115]

I'm sure that Danny can say the same about his post on training his kids.


Yep, sure can. My training came from my dad, who would take the gun away if I did something wrong. I never did hunt without my gun.

As the years went by, he did not realize I could actually outshoot ALL of his hunting buddies until I hit a quail at 40 yards........one that he said not to shoot at. I was actually a better shot than him.

My point, I used guns all my life, I used them alot, I learned the right way the first time..............

 

[ddrane2115]

Bonehead, I would send you to the 10 post ban if I could. Just thinking of anyone other than that sweetheart in that uniform is just damaging...............she can be my nurse anytime!

 

[bczoom]

I never did hunt without my gun.

Ahhhh, me neither.

Did I miss something?

 

[ddrane2115]

Yeah, I would have had to go hunting, but as a reminder of good gun handling WITHOUT my gun in hand.............that would have been bad.......

 

[BoneheadNW]

Just thinking of anyone other than that sweetheart in that uniform is just damaging...............she can be my nurse anytime!

Just think of my hairy butt sticking through those stockings. Try not to think about it during your next meal though.
Bone