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Got robbed today-neighbor held 1 at gunpoint

This is just a guess, but a Circular saw like the ones we have on the Engines would work. Otherwise, a Halligan tool used on the door jamb would probably be more useful.

My concern would not be getting in, it would be getting out. Windows can be a useful escape route if things go bad during an interior fire attack.

As for the film, if the burglars can't get in side then neither can the fire department or the police.
 
I don't think it matters one way or the other if one lives out of town. I'm so far out that google street view couldn't get my place on camera, mainly because its a private road for one thing, but also it is very hard to locate in any event, unless one knows the area really well.

In the past 8 to 10 years I've had two burglaries, and two attempted burglaries. In the first burglary they did take a lot of personal stuff, jewellery and such like, but I seriously began to reconsider my home decor preferences when instead of taking any of the TV's or other home viewing/entertainment items they left much of them behind. ://

But, seriously, one TV was left right behind the front door with its screen smashed in; so close to the door in fact that no-one could get in, which showed that they didn't leave by the front door, but one of the other doors. What was so heartbreaking tho was that they tore up hundreds of photographs, irreplaceable things, documents, etc.

And, in the kitchen they had lined up utensils such as saucepans and defecated or urinated in them. It was soul destroyng. Fortunately, none of my dogs have ever been frightened, or hurt by the break-ins, since I usually farm them out to friends or family when I'm out of town or out of the country.

I do have alarms, and cctv now, but I'm so remote that it takes a while for anyone to notice the alarm. No-one was ever caught for that burglary. But I learned some valuable lessons about home security from it.
 
By the sounds of things, I'm kinda glad I live in a small town in Northwestern Ontario, Canada. Break n enter's are a very rare occurence around here. Most people I know leave their doors unlocked most of the time. But then again, this is Canada....not the USA. Total different mentality once you cross that imaginary line heading down there. Which is why I prefer to not travel there since I don't who is packing and who isn't. I just don't feel very safe traveling there.
 
I don't think burglaries are very common where I live, as was evident in the case of the break in at my home, LOTS OF PEOPLE OWN GUNS AND WILL USE THEM, which increases the danger to the criminals. In the towns, and even more-so in the cities, crimes are higher.

These particular guys were begging to be caught. I live in a totally lilly-white rural farm area 5 miles from a small town that has a total of 3 or 4 blacks living in it. So we had 3 black guys in a cars up in the area. First time they passed my neighbor he turned to the other neighbor and said "something ain't right."

Apparently they had been doing this for a couple weeks in the rural area and the sheriff was already looking for them.

We've lived here 16.5 years and this is the first break-in in the neighborhood. Based on the way these guys worked the area, had it not been my house that day, it would have been someone down the street.
 
By the sounds of things, I'm kinda glad I live in a small town in Northwestern Ontario, Canada. Break n enter's are a very rare occurence around here. Most people I know leave their doors unlocked most of the time. But then again, this is Canada....not the USA. Total different mentality once you cross that imaginary line heading down there. Which is why I prefer to not travel there since I don't who is packing and who isn't. I just don't feel very safe traveling there.

Groan, I was robbed more times than I can think when I lived in Canada. I feel much safer down here. In Canada the criminals have free run because they know no one is allowed to defend themselves and the courts are extremely lenient.

The main difference is rural vs. urban and the fact that I have chosen places that are not criminal friendly.
 
I don't think burglaries are very common where I live, as was evident in the case of the break in at my home, LOTS OF PEOPLE OWN GUNS AND WILL USE THEM, which increases the danger to the criminals. In the towns, and even more-so in the cities, crimes are higher.

These particular guys were begging to be caught. I live in a totally lilly-white rural farm area 5 miles from a small town that has a total of 3 or 4 blacks living in it. So we had 3 black guys in a cars up in the area. First time they passed my neighbor he turned to the other neighbor and said "something ain't right."

Apparently they had been doing this for a couple weeks in the rural area and the sheriff was already looking for them.

We've lived here 16.5 years and this is the first break-in in the neighborhood. Based on the way these guys worked the area, had it not been my house that day, it would have been someone down the street.

Bob, you have some good neighbors. I like to think my neighbors would be that good but I'm probably the most vigilant of the bunch. I always challenge suspicious vehicles by walking up and taking pictures of their license plates while asking them if they need "help". At a minimum I stare at them with the evil eye and make sure they know they are noticed. Makes then leave pretty quick.
 
Groan, I was robbed more times than I can think when I lived in Canada. I feel much safer down here. In Canada the criminals have free run because they know no one is allowed to defend themselves and the courts are extremely lenient.

The main difference is rural vs. urban and the fact that I have chosen places that are not criminal friendly.

I was surprised to see all the security measures in RURAL parts of Wales, Scotland, and England. According to the US media those places are all unicorns and pixie dust perfect. But according to the people I spoke with (and we rent cottages among them) break ins and petty thefts are very common.

I tend to agree with PB, criminals in our rural areas are AFRAID of confronting homeowners here because they stand a very real chance of getting shot by homeowners. The punk who got caught by my neighbor was begging for the police to show up because he knew he would not be shot in their custody.
 
The police called. They told us to go to the local pawn shops in the more dubious neighborhoods in the county to see if we could find our stuff.

What?
 
well maybe it's the fact you can't get out of town except by airplane or we are just a little town could also be that everybody owns gun's here, but we are able to leave our doors unlocked and nobody ever messes wih anything. some of the buisnesses have had some petty thefts and bycycles dissapear if you don't lock them up, but other wise things are pretty quiet when things are stolen it's stuff like tabaco products because if you steal a big screen or a gun where are you going to sell it.
 
The police called. They told us to go to the local pawn shops in the more dubious neighborhoods in the county to see if we could find our stuff.

What?
What indeed.
Seems a bit callous on their part, but what else are they going to suggest?
I know you and the family must feel terribly violated, Bob.

I had never been a victim of being robbed or burgled until I was a resident of the UK.
The first home Steve and I lived in (in Leeds) got burgled while we were on vacation in the south.
They took (and this is no joke) milk from the fridge, a couple of CD's.. an ancient Russian camera his Father had given him, and they clipped the strings on his Fender Strat... why we couldn't figure out.
They broke in through the back garden via the dining room sliding door.
A month or so later, my Renault was broken into, and the stereo was missing.
Replaced it, and the same damn thing happened again.
Well.. we moved to Normanton, Wakey after that.. where we felt safer.
 
I tend to agree with PB, criminals in our rural areas are AFRAID of confronting homeowners here because they stand a very real chance of getting shot by homeowners. The punk who got caught by my neighbor was begging for the police to show up because he knew he would not be shot in their custody.

Exactly! The Brits are hampered by what is permissible in defence of their homes and even of themselves. Over there rural area's are more vunerable than in the States, imho. I mean, look at Tony Martins story, poor guy, and he had been persecuted for years by burglaries and seriously determined vandals.
 
UPDATE on the insurance end of things. That all looks like it will work out OK. The agent told me to replace the stolen TV set and the 2 computers because they are daily use items at home and for work (at least the computers). So those are now replaced and I'm supposed to submit receipts. The local board up service that I used is an authorized company for the insurance company, I don't even have to pay the bill to them, insurance will pay directly. The same firms replaces windows, so that is another headache that I don't need to worry about. The local agent and the phone support at headquarters have all been helpful in giving me some direction of what to do next, what they will do, etc.

Its premature to say for sure, but it looks like +1 for State Farm Insurance.

Other than the trauma to the dog and the mental anguish experienced by my wife and daughter it looks like things will get back to normal soon. My wife is now having me carry at the house and she knows where a gun is at all times for her access. The alarm is now set, even when we are home, too.

The big dog is returning to normal. We still are not sure what they did to her. Obviously they threw concrete blocks at her, they may have also TAZED her too?



What indeed.
Seems a bit callous on their part, but what else are they going to suggest?
It struck me as very odd. But the more I think about it the more it makes sense. We'll be visiting several today to see if we can find anything.




Exactly! The Brits are hampered by what is permissible in defence of their homes and even of themselves. Over there rural area's are more vunerable than in the States, imho. I mean, look at Tony Martins story, poor guy, and he had been persecuted for years by burglaries and seriously determined vandals.
That is one nice thing about most of the US States (not all have this right) but we can shoot to kill if someone breaks in our home.

As the guy down the street said the to thug he captured at gunpoint: "You are in farmer land down here, we all have guns!" For the most part that seems to be true, especially in my state. We have the highest rate of civilian carry (based on issued carry licenses) in the US. Roughly 11% of the adults in this state have a license to carry a gun in public, and no license required to own or use a gun on your own property.
 
It struck me as very odd. But the more I think about it the more it makes sense. We'll be visiting several today to see if we can find anything.

Well, unless anything was of sentimental value, or irreplaceable Melensdad, I wouldn't bother... make a claim on the insurance.

Its great to know that the Dog is on the mend, it will take a good while for your wife to recover; it did me in any event.

However, if you must go, park in a safe place, and make sure y'all have more than one cell phone with you, in case of emergency. Good luck, and be safe!

Personally, I utterly support the right to bear arms... just not sure that I could point it at someone and pull the trigger tho. ://

Aren't Pawnbrokers supposed to check a data-base of stolen articles before they buy anything?
 
Well, unless anything was of sentimental value, or irreplaceable Melensdad, I wouldn't bother ...
That is the only stuff I really am concerned about finding.

My dad's watch (valuable & sentimental) and my wife's mom's and grandmother's jewelry (not particularly valuable but very sentimental).
 
That is the only stuff I really am concerned about finding.

My dad's watch (valuable & sentimental) and my wife's mom's and grandmother's jewelry (not particularly valuable but very sentimental).

Well, I can see that the journey is necessary. Y'all stay safe out there! :flowers:
 
Been reading this thread with interest. Most folks have a hard time finding my place and there is only one road in and out. The fact that the dogs are somewhat unruly to strangers is impressed on anyone who ever comes here. The Amish gossip train spreads the word pretty well also and I have gone to the door more than once with a gun in hand while the dogs are jumping against the sliding door. I don't lock things up unless we are going to be away with a few of the dogs with us. Unless they come in a vehicle it is a tough climb up the hill to get here.
 
Been reading this thread with interest. Most folks have a hard time finding my place and there is only one road in and out. The fact that the dogs are somewhat unruly to strangers is impressed on anyone who ever comes here. ....

Ditto on all the same points.

We are on a dead end in an out of the way spot that few know about, even some of the mapping software doesn't have our road on it (I've been here 16+ years). There is only 1 way in, 1 way out. The big dog bounced against the front glass trying to get to people who come to the doors. I tend to hold her collar when I answer the door if I don't recognize the person at the door and she remains very aggressive in those situations. The UPS man is afraid to get out of the truck.

I'd say your home is as safe as mine. For whatever that is worth.
 
Bob, doesn't your sister- in- law live on, or very near your property?
Where was she when all of this went down?
I know you mentioned she was moving out, but didn't you say she was still on the property, just not above the garage or something like where she used to be?

I'd also like to know why your neighbour (you know, the guy who is close enough to wave at you from across the way-- the one you had a problem with recently).. wasn't aware of any of this going on.

I don't live in the sticks, but I am close to the outer limits.
Around here we look out for each other.
It's not exactly a neighbourhood watch thing, but we all have an agreement to alert when we see something potentially strange going on.
The redneck trouble makers are also aware of those of us who own guns.. as we've had to remind them on many a wild weekend. :yum::biggrin:
 
I've scheduled an install date with an authorized 3M Security Film installer to coat all my vulnerable glass with security film. My wife will feel much more secure after this is accomplished. If you have any large ground floor windows or patio doors you really need to consider getting security film installed! I've thought about it for the past 2 years ever since I had it installed on one of my businesses, procrastination proved to be my own downfall as it would have prevented this mess!

The alarm company is upgrading my alarm system this week and adding a camera system too. Even if I had put the alarm on when we went out for lunch the system installed in my home would not have sent an alarm call until they opened the door to leave! The original security firm that installed the system did not install a 'glass break' sensor . . . Perhaps they were not commonly installed 17 years ago when this system was put in??? So my stem would not have tripped the alarm until these guys were leaving based on the way they entered and exited!!!

If you have an older alarm system please consider upgrading to a newer system with more and different sensors.

The security firm I switched to several years ago for business looked at my home system and is making some major modifications.
 
Bob, doesn't your sister- in- law live on, or very near your property? . . . I'd also like to know why your neighbour (you know, the guy who is close enough to wave at you from across the way-- the one you had a problem with recently).. wasn't aware of any of this going on...
As for the closest neighbor (that is my sister in law) she lives in the apartment above my workshop/garage. She cannot even see our home from there because of window orientation, but more so because of trees and terrain. She was leaving for work and as she drove past our driveway (she has hew own drive 275' south of mine) she saw someone in my driveway. As this happened another neighbor was approaching in his truck, she alerted him and both went into action as other neighbors also got involved.

As for the neighbor who doesn't like me, he lives on the other side of the workshop/apartment and even if he was looking straight at it from his house could not see my house because the view is blocked by terrain, trees, and my workshop. He is only 350' away but unless I am in my yard and he is in his we cannot see each other. In the winter when the leaves are off the trees I can only see the peak of his roof.

The neighbor to my north is also separated from me by about 350' but his house is also absurd by terrain and trees and our houses are totally shielded from each other.

Across the street is similar. Even standing in a clearing at the front of my property I can see NONE of the houses on the other side of the road.

My home is visible from the road, as are most along the road, but because of the terrain and trees, several of us have quite a large degree of privacy. Just like any other "neighborhood" most homes are lined up along the roadway, but unlike most neighborhoods, many of us cannot actually see the houses "next door" to us because of trees/terrain UNLESS we are outside in our front yards. The neighbor to my south can see my workshop and visa-versa. But the house just 1 door south of him is all but invisible to him. Then from that next house south there are 5 or 6 houses that can 'see each other' until the road turns into the woods and houses all disappear again. The road goes through the woods and on the other side is former farm land where another half dozes homes have views of each other. But the homes on the lots in the woods are totally obscured from each other and from the roadway. So in a neighborhood of 29 homes, roughly 20 can be seen from the road, but just because your home can be seen from the road (like mine) it does not mean that I can see my neighbors or visa-versa.

Below is a satellite image of our neighborhood. One road in, it splits into a small cul-du-sac at the southwest corner and goes through the woods to the east. At the extreme east it dead ends into a cross street that services only 6 houses as that street dead ends one both ends. This image is from Google Earth, it does not show my new workshop/apartment. It also makes the land appear flat, and while it is relatively so, my lots elevation changes 60'. Just from my front door to my back door the elevation drop is 8 or 9 feet. My workshop sits at roughly 5' higher elevation than my house, but between the 2 structures (maybe 120' apart) the elevation drops about 8' before it rises again up to the workshop which, as I said, actually sits higher than the house. So it is the combination of dips, rises and trees that create privacy. In the summer my workshop is NOT VISIBLE from the house, even if you are outside standing on the patio looking toward the workshop, heck I can barely see the edge of the new swimming pool from my kitchen patio (faces the pool) and the pool is between the house and the workshop.
 

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Sorry to read about this Bob. I just got back from Boston for a bit before we have to go back. I always worry about my (barely) adult kids watching the place and living here along with friends and neighbors dropping in. We've had a couple of 'scares' in the last 10 years (sorry, but IMHO, the increase is a result of liberal justice systems that leave even dimwits realizing that there isn't much of a down-side; even if they get caught).

In our cases, our two German Shepherd Dogs almost certainly foiled the 'spur of the moment' crime attempts. Of the two dogs, Bruno would only bark his freaking head off. In no instance could I see him physically defend anything except against physical harm to one of my kids. Dargo, however, was trained and is a good poker player; he just doesn't show his hand as far as what he is going to do. He was never trained to "attack" per se, but stop and detain.

Other than that all I have is a relatively high number of cameras recording nearly all of my property. Also, there is a "pinch point" to my property; only one way in and one way out. In an emergency, I could change that with heavy equipment, but for now it assures me clear pictures of everyone entering and exiting the property. Realistically, I've been rather lucky. No alarm system would really work for us since we have kids and guests coming at all hours all the time (police stated that as another deterrent).

The two times young punks came back to my place to burgle my place they were deterred by the two dogs. Once the recordings clearly show the punks trying to run them down in their truck and destroying my yard. :hammer: Fortunately, after a quick review of the recordings we had the punks and their parents sitting at the police station with us that same day. What is baffling is, in my cases, the families had money; their kids were just thugs. Hopefully you get your missing items back. I don't know about you, but I felt violated and nobody even entered my home or shops.
 
... I don't know about you, but I felt violated and nobody even entered my home or shops.

My wife feels that way and is now having me make sure that she knows where guns are, that I am carrying more, etc.

My wife is also very afraid for herself and my daughter now, something she was never worried about.

I know Dargo is well trained, far more than my Misha, but 3 thugs throwing concrete blocks and using a stun guns had her whimpering and afraid. I actually have had to pick her up and carry her back into the house because she didn't want to come back inside. This is an aggressive 100# dog that is naturally aggressive to strangers (and cats), she has a long history of bouncing her body off the front door glass and having people fall backwards down our steps. Our UPS driver, who is on a first name basis with us, won't get out of his truck until I have my hand on her collar.

Oh, and you mentioned 1 choke point. DITTO here. Fall off my driveway and your car ends up going down 25' into the woods on the north side, and a natural berm on the south side prevents exit that way. It took a bull dozer to 'cut' a path to my house, one way in/out.
 
I know Dargo is well trained, far more than my Misha, but 3 thugs throwing concrete blocks and using a stun guns had her whimpering and afraid. I actually have had to pick her up and carry her back into the house because she didn't want to come back inside.

Perhaps having Bruno, physically looks identical, but is a lover and not a fighter helps. Someone who doesn't know us wouldn't know that, while Bruno will bark his f*cking head off, he would never join in an attack unless one of my kids were involved (never trained, just his nature). Bruno would probably get his ass kicked because he barks and growls so much but Dargo gives no warning; just prefers a stealth attack. That's how they get raccoons, possums etc. that get too close to the house; Bruno barks at them until they are deaf and ready to be sedated and Dargo sneaks up from behind and does the dirty work. Still, he generally pays no attention to people coming and going unless they seem nervous or are black or Mexican (freaking racist dog!). I cannot tell you why, but Dargo does NOT like black people or Mexicans. I don't get it.

Anyway, in complete defense to you dog, all police agree that dogs are just a deterrent; not a form of 4 legged police or super being that stops crime. Professional criminals are not deterred by dogs, but they do watch for them since they prefer to not get bitten. The same goes for a firearm owning household. Criminals really never are looking for a gunfight, unless it's some gang sort of thing, and strongly prefer an easy target. I enjoy being known as "that nut with a lot of machine guns who shoots a lot".
 
...I enjoy being known as "that nut with a lot of machine guns who shoots a lot".

One of the deputy sheriffs who was out searching the grounds was very impressed with my shooting range :smile:

'nuff said on that :whistling:
 
Well, unless anything was of sentimental value, or irreplaceable Melensdad, I wouldn't bother... make a claim on the insurance.

Its great to know that the Dog is on the mend, it will take a good while for your wife to recover; it did me in any event.

However, if you must go, park in a safe place, and make sure y'all have more than one cell phone with you, in case of emergency. Good luck, and be safe!

Personally, I utterly support the right to bear arms... just not sure that I could point it at someone and pull the trigger tho. ://

Aren't Pawnbrokers supposed to check a data-base of stolen articles before they buy anything?
Lia comming from a gulf war vet it's pretty easy to do if they are shooting at you
 
Lia comming from a gulf war vet it's pretty easy to do if they are shooting at you

I'm sure thats true for those who have been trained in combat dds, and let me tell you that I have the greatest admiration and respect for you and all out boys who have been, or are out there fighting for our country, and democracy, and repelling our enemies... You're all heroes!

However, I have never had anyone 'come at me with menace,' and so I've never really felt the need to defend myself in such dire circumstances. I often, as I don't doubt many women do, wonder how I would react if I were to feel so threatened that I needed to look for a weapon. :unsure:
 
One of the deputy sheriffs who was out searching the grounds was very impressed with my shooting range :smile:

'nuff said on that :whistling:

Tell them they have an open invitation to come and shoot that would be the best deterrent cop car already there there.

tom
 
I often, as I don't doubt many women do, wonder how I would react if I were to feel so threatened that I needed to look for a weapon. :unsure:

I understand the way you feel about that.

Well, I should say I once understood.
My eldest son worried about me being alone and he knew I didn't really like guns or being around them for years.
That's all changed now.
I am not the least bit afraid of them now, or handling them.. nor would I be afraid of using one if I ever felt like I were in the position of actually having to use one to defend myself.
 
Well today there are a bunch of 600line ultra high resolution armored vandal resistent color security cameras being wired up to watch the property. These have graduated IR output as well for night vision so the IR emitters won't bleed out the image during night viewing.
 
funny reading this thread..."choke points", 1 way in/out to the house, dogs, alarms.
I'm set up the same way.
we live at the end of a 1/2mile pvt. drive that invisable to the public because of trees and topography. The only way to see my house is from the air. The road is cut through the woods, no way to turn around and my driveway has a 3' drop on both sides for 50'.
Google maps has my road wrong.
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=41.991299,-84.274954&spn=0.003198,0.009613&t=h&z=17

you can barely see my roof in the upper left corner:shifty:

for anyone interested, logitec has a security camera that records with motion actication, date and time- you can view it live over the internet or a smart phone.
http://www.logitech.com/en-us/video-security-systems
 
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