# windows 8



## NorthernRedneck

File your complaints here!  Or your compliments. What do you or don't your like about it?  

I just picked up a slightly used dell inspiron laptop with windows 8 on it.  I was originally looking for a touch screen but settled for this one as it was cheap.  Anyways, I'm still undecided on whether I can endure windows 8 or if I prefer 7.  First impression.....Windows 8 is microsofts answer to android based tablets and cell phones.  I think that once I get used to how to do things with 8 it won't be all that bad.  Another first impression is that the speed of 8 leavetyss 7 in the dust.  It's FAST!!!

Cons so far....have to relearn the whole system and how to do things.  The app store sucks so far but I'm sure that will improve.  Heck...ford didn't produce a mustang right out of the box when they first opened up shop back in the early 1900's.  Give it some time and I'm sure there will be plenty of apps available.

Now...as for this dell laptop...if I could only figure out how to disable the stupid mouse pad on the keyboard I'd be all set.  Definitely not designed for someone with bigger hands.  Very sensitive and my hands keep touching it when typing.  I use a mouse anyways and never the pad on the keyboard.


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## bczoom

For the mouse pad, you can check the bios and probably disable there.  Otherwise, I'd:
a) find out the name of the driver and disable it.
b) plug in an external mouse which should automatically disable the touchpad.


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## jwstewar

That is what I've been saying all along. Glad to see someone else agrees with me. Is it different, yes, but so was Windows 95 when it came along.


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## muleman RIP

If you located the program for the finger pad just delete it from the startup menu. This will disable it. Plugging in an external does not disable it is win7 as they both work on the wife's Asus.


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## Dargo

Well, I figure I wasted about a grand on what is now known nationally to be a complete and total disaster; Windows 8.  I have not the time nor desire to completely wipe out the hard drive and install an earlier version of Windows.  It's bad enough that you are required to spend hours on previous versions dumping unwanted programs that hog up system resources and hard drive space, but now even after you get rid of all the "commercials" that are pre-loaded on your Windows based computer, you are left with a completely useless OS.

I really didn't care if all publications and computer magazines agreed with me, but it seems to be pretty well unanimous, Windows 8 is a complete flop.  I like the article I read in one of the PC magazines who said it is an Apple plant working at Microsoft who got Microsoft to not only put out a useless OS, but spend hundreds of millions in advertising to try to get people to keep trying to use the extremely user-unfriendly OS that hamstrings all other programs on the system.  IMHO, it would be like Lexus selling only rebadged Yugos for 2014 and blanketing the airwaves telling people how great their new Lexus (Yugo) is.

So, in summary, there is absolutely NOTHING I like about Windows 8.  Well, except that it is making Apple stock go up. 

Oh, I forgot; for your mouse thing, I can't get anyone in my home to use the laptop with Windows 8 on it because nobody has the patience to deal with the defective software that CONSTANTLY makes the screen to to "full screen" anytime you use the touch pad.  We just about wore the F11 key out just fighting that one issue let alone the hundreds of other maddening problems plaguing Windows 8.  But, alas, their customer support keeps telling us that a "major" update will be released soon.  (Um, they've been telling customers that for months)


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## rlk

I've had a new Dell with Windows 8 and wish I had gotten Windows 7 instead.  To me, it looks like Microsoft just cobbled together some software, and released it without giving it much thought.  For example: 
- Finding all the hidden icons to re-boot or put the system to sleep was a pain.
- Having MS office icons some where other than on the desktop is another pain.
- Each time I plug my iPhone in to charge it or to sync it, Windows 8, or something wants to download all the photos from my phone to the PC.  There are already 2 copies of my photos on the PC - I don't need a 3rd copy.  I'm sure there is a way to fix this - I just haven't found it yet.
- My PC thinks it is using dial-up instead of DSL.  About twice a day I have to go through several windows to cancel it's attempts to dial the network.  Here again, I'm sure there is a fix, I just  have not found it yet.
- Windows 8 did away with the gadgets that Vista and Windows 7 had.  I found a piece of software that would restore the gadgets.  It works well except that the weather app will not update itself, and many days the calendar will not change to the next day.  This usually occurs after I have put the PC to sleep for a couple days.
- Many of the games will not run in a small window - they take over all of the screen.  In Vista & Windows 7 you could have a game open in a small window on the desktop, along with some other things.  Now, games like Solitaire take up the whole screen.
- I have had two different occasions where FireFox would not work as it should have.  Both times I had to finish what I was trying to do with Internet Explorer.  

    On the first occasion, after finishing with IE, FireFox started working as it should.  I turned in a trouble ticket with the site where I had the problem.  They had no explanation but felt that IE must have found a bad setting and corrected it which allowed FireFox to work again.

    On the second occasion, we were trying to download iTunes 11.1.  FireFox would not download it.  The screen would blink a couple times than nothing would happen.  IE downloaded it and installed it with no problem.  I can't test FireFox on that now since IE has already downloaded the software.    

This morning I told my wife that I'm about ready to purchase Windows 7 while we still can.  

Bob


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## Adillo303

In December last year, you could get windows 8 for $14.00.

I upgraded all four of my pc's. I am fine with it. I am surprised that folks will go buy an apple or an android, learn a new O/S and sing it's praises. Change their windows and they rebel.

 Turn it on, when it boots up click in desktop, load power 8 which is free and you are pretty much on win 7. It is faster, it does not really crash a lot, at the very worst no more than prior versions. Mine hasn't crashed at all. 

Sheesh already, if you can't handle change, stay away from computers.


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## rlk

Adillo303 said:


> In December last year, you could get windows 8 for $14.00.


In my opinion, that's all Windows 8 is worth. 



Adillo303 said:


> Sheesh already, if you can't handle change, stay away from computers.


Believe me, I can handle change.  I worked in IS for Big Blue for over 30 years.  During that time, if I had installed software with as many bugs as Windows 8, I'd have been looking for a new job.

Bob


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## jwstewar

rlk said:


> In my opinion, that's all Windows 8 is worth.
> 
> 
> Believe me, I can handle change. I worked in IS for Big Blue for over 30 years. During that time, if I had installed software with as many bugs as Windows 8, I'd have been looking for a new job.
> 
> Bob


 
Now I know you are lying, because I have yet to see any IBM software install and work without having to open a PMR and request a hot fix from them. doesn't matter if it is mainframe, server, or PC.


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## Dargo

rlk said:


> Believe me, I can handle change.  I worked in IS for Big Blue for over 30 years.  During that time, if I had installed software with as many bugs as Windows 8, I'd have been looking for a new job.
> 
> Bob



According to all the online blogs and the guy who purchased the computer store I used to own, no version of any operating system is as thoroughly despised as Windows 8.  If you can believe the blogs, heads are rolling at MS and they are in a mad scramble to completely change Windows 8 in their new release and that is why the "update" has been delayed over and over again.

I used to actually enjoy the excitement of a new OS and all the upgrades.  Apparently MS wanted to recoup some money from R&D expenses, so they released Windows 8 knowing it basically is a disaster but they'd release 'updates' to fix it as they are able.  IMHO, after owning a computer business and being a die hard PC fan (I even wondered why anyone would buy an overpriced Mac), it is really disheartening to see MS release an OS that is so bad it needs to be completely scrapped and MS needs to start all over with a clean slate.  

From an end user stand point I, like most other people posting on the internet, see absolutely nothing in Win 8 that I like.  It sure has helped Apple sales though.  I believe it was Ed Baig (sp?) from USA Today who said that Windows 8 will put MS where Apple was 15 years ago and move Apple to where MS was 15 years ago.  That is when there was a very small, but fiercely loyal, group of Mac lovers who kept the company barely above water while the masses insisted on owning a PC.


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## NorthernRedneck

So far I'm enduring it.  Can't say that I exactly like it as it is.  I like the concept.  Not too crazy about the execution though.  Take everything you thought you knew about windows and throw it out the window.  Go in with a complete mental void and maybe you might like it.  It's definately not a smooth transition going from from 7 to 8.  I liken it to learning how to walk.  First you take those baby steps (3.1)  then you start to walk (v95-millenium)  then you start to run (xp, vista and 7).  Just when you think you've got this whole walking thing figured out and its smooth sailing, someone comes along and tells you you're doing it all wrong and you have to get backl down on all fours and relearn how to crawl again.


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## Adillo303

Interesting discussion.

So far as IBM - I worked for another mainframe manufacturer and installed and maintained O/S's. They all have bugs.

I am not going to sing the praises of Win 8 or any other O/S for that matter. I bought and loaded Win 8. It works for me.


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## jpr62902

How many of the Windows 8 haters here are using it on a machine that has a touch screen?  That is, after all, the environment for which it was designed.


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## NorthernRedneck

jpr62902 said:


> How many of the Windows 8 haters here are using it on a machine that has a touch screen?  That is, after all, the environment for which it was designed.



I would have loved to have a touch screen.  I cheaped out at the last second and wound up with just a regular screen.  I'm learning the system.  I like some features and the basic concept behind 8.  For me, it just took basically shutting my brain off and forgetting everything I knew about windows.  For example, there's a cool little ebay app that you can download.  I do a lot of ebay shopping.  So I figured I'd give it a try.  The main screen for the app is simple and basic and works good.  But I wound up just staring at it for hours trying to figure out how the heck to search for something on ebay using the app because there isn't the traditional search bar.  I ended up figuring out that you have to slide the mouse over the bottom right corner to bring up the main side bar.  Then select search(which I originally thought was just a standard google type search option).  Make sure that ebay is highlighted in the list of apps then type in your search in there.  Like I said...totally different and not where you'd think the standard search bar would be for a program.  Just little things like that that will take some getting used to.


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## rlk

jpr62902 said:


> How many of the Windows 8 haters here are using it on a machine that has a touch screen?  That is, after all, the environment for which it was designed.



I don't understand the value of the touch screen.  Since I already have my right hand on the mouse, what sense does it make to reach across the keyboard to touch the screen to open an application that will require me to use my mouse in order to navigate the application?  

Also, from the desktop, which is where I do 90% of my work, don't you still have to use the mouse?

Bob


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## JimVT

you can do it all without a mouse or do it all with it. do don't need both. you do need a keyboard for some things. I find it more convenient to use on a laptop  because of the closeness of the screen.


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## rlk

JimVT said:


> you can do it all without a mouse or do it all with it. do don't need both. you do need a keyboard for some things. I find it more convenient to use on a laptop  because of the closeness of the screen.



Jim, help me understand.  When I open MS Word or Excel or write an email, are you saying I can use the touch screen to do everything a mouse does?

If so, I did not realize you could do that.  When shopping for the new Dell I have, the salesman told me you would still need a mouse to move around in the MS products.

Bob


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## Galvatron

windows 8 in simple is for touch screen...if you don't use touch screen don't bother,stick with 7.


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## NorthernRedneck

Been a couple weeks with windows 8 for me.  I'm quickly learning how to use it.  So far it isn't all bad.  I don't have the touch screen and I'm managing fine without it.  In reality, it's windows 7 meets android operating system.  You still have the classic windows 7 appearance to go along with the button android looking system.


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## NorthernRedneck

It is what it is.  I'm getting used to it now.  I'm not a huge fan but I'm enduring it.  To me, windows 8 is microsofts afterthought answer to android based operating systems.  The concept is there.  The execution...not so much.


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## Catavenger

hmmm touch screen sounds messy reminds me that I need to wash my windows - on the house that is not the computer!


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## NorthernRedneck

Ok.  I got the update notice from Microsoft to upgrade to 8.1 for free so I did it.  That was a few days ago.  Ever since, my wifi keeps shutting down after about 20 mins.  I have to keep reconnecting.  It sucks when watching a video then you loose connection halfway through and have to restart the video once the wifi is started again.  I did some research and there are a number of different threads on different sites all saying the same thing.  I updated the wireless router drivers but that didn't solve the problem.  Microsoft at this point is saying there is no problem with it.  Watch in a while to see if they don't come out with 8.2 to fix the bugs found in 8.1.


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## jpr62902

groomerguyNWO said:


> Ok. I got the update notice from Microsoft to upgrade to 8.1 for free so I did it. That was a few days ago. Ever since, my wifi keeps shutting down after about 20 mins. I have to keep reconnecting. It sucks when watching a video then you loose connection halfway through and have to restart the video once the wifi is started again. I did some research and there are a number of different threads on different sites all saying the same thing. I updated the wireless router drivers but that didn't solve the problem. Microsoft at this point is saying there is no problem with it. Watch in a while to see if they don't come out with 8.2 to fix the bugs found in 8.1.


 
 I upgraded last weekend -- no problems so far.  Actually, my computer boots up a little faster and IE 11 is _much_ faster.


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## NorthernRedneck

Overall I like the upgrade.  It is faster and seems to run smooth with no hickups for any other applications.  The only complaint I have with 8.1 is that I keep having to reconnect to my wifi every 20 or so minutes.


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## JimVT

groomerguyNWO said:


> Overall I like the upgrade. It is faster and seems to run smooth with no hickups for any other applications. The only complaint I have with 8.1 is that I keep having to reconnect to my wifi every 20 or so minutes.


 did  you try running all the diagnostics in win 8? I have some problems like that but only during heavy use. Like when school is getting out.
jim


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## jpr62902

groomerguyNWO said:


> Ok. I got the update notice from Microsoft to upgrade to 8.1 for free so I did it. That was a few days ago. Ever since, my wifi keeps shutting down after about 20 mins. I have to keep reconnecting. It sucks when watching a video then you loose connection halfway through and have to restart the video once the wifi is started again. I did some research and there are a number of different threads on different sites all saying the same thing.* I updated the wireless router drivers but that didn't solve the problem*. Microsoft at this point is saying there is no problem with it. Watch in a while to see if they don't come out with 8.2 to fix the bugs found in 8.1.


 
 I had this issue some months ago, and the problem was actually the updated driver.  When I reverted to the prior version, I didn't have any issue with my wifi.


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## Dargo

groomerguyNWO said:


> Ok.  I got the update notice from Microsoft to upgrade to 8.1 for free so I did it.  That was a few days ago.  Ever since, my wifi keeps shutting down after about 20 mins.  I have to keep reconnecting.  It sucks when watching a video then you loose connection halfway through and have to restart the video once the wifi is started again.  I did some research and there are a number of different threads on different sites all saying the same thing.  I updated the wireless router drivers but that didn't solve the problem.  Microsoft at this point is saying there is no problem with it.  Watch in a while to see if they don't come out with 8.2 to fix the bugs found in 8.1.



Of course Microsoft will blame someone else! Duh!  Even *before* they had the worst OS in existence, when I owned a computer store I learned MS always blames a 3rd party vendor.  That must be written on the first page of their employee handbook.  I got $300 out of a basically unused high end Lenovo I bought about 6 months ago with the virus known as Windows 8 on it.  I figure if I sell everything Microsoft in my home and office I may have enough to buy me a 13" MacBook Pro.


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## rlk

rlk said:


> Jim, help me understand.  When I open MS Word or Excel or write an email, are you saying I can use the touch screen to do everything a mouse does?
> 
> If so, I did not realize you could do that.  When shopping for the new Dell I have, the salesman told me you would still need a mouse to move around in the MS products.
> 
> Bob



Does anyone know the answer to whether you can move around in the MS products just by using the touch screen?

Bob


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## tommu56

My wife bought an ACER lap top with windows 8 

it isnt too bad one short cut i found on the web Xand windows key gets you menu to go to control panel 

It took me 2 hrs to clean off the junk that either she down loaded in 3 weeks or came with machine that kept popping up and annoying her.

I went back and added AGV and Spybot search and destroy 

I went to make restore point  but couldn't fin how to do it any ideas????

Web searches didn't produce the same screen shots I was seeing when doing the key strikes to get to them and couldn't find how to do it.

tom


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## JimVT

go to apps and put in what your looking for. a search on your win 8 should also bring it up.  I put in restore and it came up on my sony.
if your having touch screen problems try not to  touch the screen when you turn it on.


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## NorthernRedneck

Ok...I'll admit.  Windows 8 is starting to grow on me.  I'm getting used to it now and can kinda sorta stand it.  Overall, way less updates than 7.  My 7 machine was giving me problems freezing up halfway through the 526 misc updates it did on a weekly basis.  I liked 7 but found that half the time the OS was doing updates.  So far with this thing it's been pretty much flawless.  No freezing up.


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## NorthernRedneck

Now, I ended up getting the missus a new dell inspiron touch screen a while back with windows 8 as well.  We kinda had no choice in the matter.  Her other laptop was only a year old but apparently laptops don't like tea as much as she does.

After we dried it out the thing wouldn't even turn on.  I tried it again yesterday and the thing finally turned on after a month or so.  Only thing now is the keyboard is fried.  Only half the keys work.  I managed to bypass the login screen using the "ease of access" onscreen keyboard to type in the password and the rest of the system seems fine.  I went on ebay and found a new replacement keyboard for it for a whopping $13 including shipping.  I figure before we junk her old $800 laptop I'll try replacing the keyboard.


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## Dargo

groomerguyNWO said:


> Ok...I'll admit.  Windows 8 is starting to grow on me.  I'm getting used to it now and can kinda sorta stand it.  Overall, way less updates than 7.  My 7 machine was giving me problems freezing up halfway through the 526 misc updates it did on a weekly basis.  I liked 7 but found that half the time the OS was doing updates.  So far with this thing it's been pretty much flawless.  No freezing up.



Windows 8 grew on me so much that I literally GAVE AWAY the last laptop I had that it rendered completely useless.  Believe it or not, about half of the people passed on getting a free laptop if it came with Windows 8.  The internet is now so full of millions of people complaining about Winblows 8 that Microsoft is now HEAVILY subsidizing all ads for computers loaded with Winblows 8 to try and get them off the shelves before they get version 9 out and, they hope, prevents the complete collapse of Windows. Even worse for Microsoft, I've read that version 8.1 is, somehow, even worse than 8!  I personally cannot imagine anything worse than 8, but apparently Microsoft screwed up even worse with an attempted quick fix to stop the severe hemorrhaging of customers due to a disastrous OS.  Like many others, I'm finished with anything 'Windows' related for life.  Hopefully you are able to still use your computer.


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## NorthernRedneck

Dargo said:


> Windows 8 grew on me so much that I literally GAVE AWAY the last laptop I had that it rendered completely useless.  Believe it or not, about half of the people passed on getting a free laptop if it came with Windows 8.  The internet is now so full of millions of people complaining about Winblows 8 that Microsoft is now HEAVILY subsidizing all ads for computers loaded with Winblows 8 to try and get them off the shelves before they get version 9 out and, they hope, prevents the complete collapse of Windows. Even worse for Microsoft, I've read that version 8.1 is, somehow, even worse than 8!  I personally cannot imagine anything worse than 8, but apparently Microsoft screwed up even worse with an attempted quick fix to stop the severe hemorrhaging of customers due to a disastrous OS.  Like many others, I'm finished with anything 'Windows' related for life.  Hopefully you are able to still use your computer.



Not a problem using my computer.  Runs so much smoother and quicker than my old laptop with windows 7.


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## mla2ofus

Linda won a new Dell laptop w/ windows 8 a couple of weeks ago and gave it to me to replace my 10 yr old Gateway PC w/ XP. I think she secretly wants to put me in a rubber room,LOL!! I have tried off and on all PM and this evening trying to find a Powertoys pic resizer. Finally found one that looked similar to the XP/7 one. Free download and had to start this username and password game with them. After repeated tries using the password I'd written down when I set it, I tried setting a new one. UHUH!! When they asked if this page was helpful and I checked "NO", they asked for comments and I typed they could take all their password BS and shove it up their corporate anus!! I'm kinda getting used to 8 but dealing w/ Microsoft has gotten to be a PIA!! I'm to the point I'm ready to get this gutted out and have 7 installed!! Or maybe better, trade it for a Mac!!
                                  Rant over,
                                                Mike


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## rlk

Mike, I have asked this question but have not gotten an answer.  If you figure this out, please let me know. I want to run the App screen (the screen that comes up when you press the Windows key), not as a full screen, but minimized somewhat so I can still see things on the desktop, like my clock, calendar, volume control, etc.  So far, if anyone knows how to do it, they have not said.

To me it's a waste to have the App screen take up the entire screen.

Thanks, Bob


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## mla2ofus

RLK, so far I just feel fortunate to be able to get on the web and check E-mail. If I happen to stumble on to the solution I'll let ya know. This is a whooole different cat from XP and 7 for this ol' fart!!
                                           Mike


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## NorthernRedneck

So far, I haven't had a problem with 8 other than the odd time when it disconnects from the net and I have to manually go back and reconnect.  I'm starting to think that problem is more with our wireless router than with 8.  Mine has been running smoothly and flawlessly.  When I had 7 on my old laptop, the thing would do 137 updates every week and usually freeze up halfway through them.  I haven't had a single issue with updates with 8.  The speed is much better with 8 as well.  My old 7 machine would often freeze up and not work properly.  So far I'm satisfied.  It does take getting used to.  Like going from a dodge caravan to a ford f150.  Two completely different beasts.


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## Doc

mla2ofus said:


> RLK, so far I just feel fortunate to be able to get on the web and check E-mail. If I happen to stumble on to the solution I'll let ya know. This is a whooole different cat from XP and 7 for this ol' fart!!
> Mike


You can change Windows 8 to the old look and feel that you are used to.   the default design is for touch screen and tablets.  I prefer the old design for laptop.  I can't tell you where to change it though ...i don't remember.   I did it for a friend with a new Windows 8 laptop.  I still do not have a windows 8 machine of my own.


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## rlk

Doc said:


> You can change Windows 8 to the old look and feel that you are used to.   the default design is for touch screen and tablets.  I prefer the old design for laptop.  I can't tell you where to change it though ...i don't remember.   I did it for a friend with a new Windows 8 laptop.  I still do not have a windows 8 machine of my own.



Thanks for the info Doc.  Knowing what I know about Windows 8, I wish I didn't have a Windows 8 machine.

I'll see if I can find how to change it to the old look.  Or, if anyone knows, please chime in.

Bob


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## Doc

This might help you.  They call it "classic view".

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-vista/change-windows-to-classic-view


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## rlk

Doc said:


> This might help you.  They call it "classic view".
> 
> http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-vista/change-windows-to-classic-view



Doc your link is for Vista, not Windows 8.  I'm downloading Windows 8.1 update now to see if I can find a similar feature.

Bob


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## mla2ofus

rlk said:


> Doc your link is for Vista, not Windows 8.  I'm downloading Windows 8.1 update now to see if I can find a similar feature.
> 
> Bob



  Let me know how you like it. At this point I'm afraid of anything windows 8 that's "new and improved",LOL!!
                             Mike


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## Doc

rlk said:


> Doc your link is for Vista, not Windows 8.  I'm downloading Windows 8.1 update now to see if I can find a similar feature.
> 
> Bob


Sorry Bob.  My search was for win 8, so i thought I had found it.   I did not dig into the link.  My bad.


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## rlk

Doc said:


> Sorry Bob.  My search was for win 8, so i thought I had found it.   I did not dig into the link.  My bad.



Not a big deal Doc.

Win 8.1 was downloaded last night (took about 10 hours to download) and installed.  Of course it screwed up all my settings, gadgets, second monitor and perhaps a few other things I have not discovered yet.  I'll have to spend some time tomorrow getting things back the way they were.

In the installation, Microsoft has everything set to switch my search engine to Bing; and to let Microsoft distribute my personal information and internet usage statistics to their suppliers so they could send me "quality advertisements that fit my lifestyle".  In other words, the default is to trust Microsoft to do what is best for me.  I caught this and did a custom install where I could uncheck all the things that give up my privacy.  Microsoft should be ashamed of itself trying to trick customers like that.

Bob


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## mla2ofus

Thanks, RLK !! I think I'll just stick w/ windows 8. I have enough difficulty w/ it.
                                        Mike


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## rlk

I had some success today getting two apps to appear on the same screen, or one app to appear along with the desktop.  

Here's how I did it: When you click on an app and it takes up the entire screen, put your cursor on the left side of the screen, push the left mouse button, and slowly drag to the right.  This will re-size the app and allow the app to run alongside the desktop.  My laptop will not consistently do this - I have to play around with it to find the sweet spot.  Sometimes the sweet spot is the center of the left edge, sometimes it's at the top left corner, so you may need to play around with yours to find the right place on your screen.

Unfortunately this also screwed up the placement of the desktop icons, but I can live with that.  

You can't re-size the apps like you can a window on the desktop.  On the desktop you can grab the corner of an open window and drag it up/down/left/right or diagonally to re-size the window.  Well, so far with Windows 8.1, I can only drag the window left and right, not up and down or diagonally.  

If you drag the window from the top to the bottom it closes the window.  If you drag the window from the bottom upwards, nothing happens.  Dragging it from left to right is the only way to re-size it.  So far I haven't found a way to re-size the height of the window.

While this is an improvement over Windows 8, it still seems like a step backwards from Vista & Windows 7.

Bob


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## Doc

Good job.  That would be a huge negative for me.  I rarely do anything with full screen.  I always have multiple windows going.   Do you have a copy of win 7 that you could reload?  If not you could purchase one on ebay or at your local computer store.   But you would most likely have to wipe the drive clean to install an older version of windows.  Or add another drive, make it your c: drive then add the win8 drive with all your stuff after the install.   A pain but might be better than dealing with an OS made for tablets.


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## AmberErin

This seems like the appropriate thread for me to ay that I love Microsoft. Couldn't do my business seamlessly without it. I have windows 8 on pc, a windows phone and am currently posting from a surface. Love love love love


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## rlk

Doc said:


> Good job.  That would be a huge negative for me.  I rarely do anything with full screen.  I always have multiple windows going.   Do you have a copy of win 7 that you could reload?  If not you could purchase one on ebay or at your local computer store.   But you would most likely have to wipe the drive clean to install an older version of windows.  Or add another drive, make it your c: drive then add the win8 drive with all your stuff after the install.   A pain but might be better than dealing with an OS made for tablets.



I'm giving that serious consideration Doc even though my wife does not like the idea.  She thinks MS will drop support of win 7 shortly and we'll be forced back to win 8.  She thinks we should give 8.1 a chance before installing 7.

I ran into another problem with the upgrade to 8.1  The Samsung display connected to my laptop would not work after the upgrade.  After a day and a half of messing with it, we decided to download the Samsung drivers.  That solved the problem.  Not sure how the drivers got erased/overwritten/moved during the upgrade.

So, if you upgrade to 8.1 and an external device does not work, the first thing I would do is to refresh the drivers for the device.

Bob


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## bczoom

I have similar driver issues with Win 7.  Every time I do a Windows Update, it erases my printer driver.  Happens to others as well.

I now just keep the printer and other device drivers in a directory and re-install after the upgrades.


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## Doc

Was talking with a co worker the yesterday who said he modified his win8 to be much like win7.  Searching via google will bring up the links.  Some of them were not from microsoft.  You have to install one program and modify registry but the instructions were clear and worked fantastic for him.  He said it involved about 5 separate steps total.


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## NorthernRedneck

So far I canèt really copmplain with 8. its different for sure.  its microsofts answer to androidand apple based software.  I think you have to look at windows 8 with that mindframe instead of comparing it to windows 7.  As far as speed and errors.  My last computer with 7 was a dinosaur compared to the new one with 8 on it.  This one has been running flawlessly so far.  With 7, it seemed like there were 187 different updates every week and they would often not install on the first shot.


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## Dargo

I hate to see people getting screwed.  I'm part of the 75% loss Microsoft has suffered in desktop and personal computers.  I stayed loyal to them until the boondoggle of Windows 8, and then I completely jumped ship.  Microsoft used to be on over 95% of new computers sold and now they are only on around 20%; below both Android *and* Apple.

As is no surprise, Microsoft's introduction of Windows 8 only accelerated Microsoft's loss of market share instead, Microsoft hoped, of increasing their market share.  As stated in many places, "Despite everyone’s high hopes for Windows 8 reviving the slumping PC market, Microsoft’s operating system has exacerbated its losses instead."  An average and reasonable article stating as much can be read here Did Microsoft Kill the PC Market with Windows 8?  Microsoft has billions of dollars to spend.  Hopefully they abandon their awful new OS and start anew with something that can legitimately compete.


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## jpr62902

Dargo said:


> I hate to see people getting screwed. I'm part of the 75% loss Microsoft has suffered in desktop and personal computers. I stayed loyal to them until the boondoggle of Windows 8, and then I completely jumped ship. Microsoft used to be on over 95% of new computers sold and now they are only on around 20%; below both Android *and* Apple.
> 
> As is no surprise, Microsoft's introduction of Windows 8 only accelerated Microsoft's loss of market share instead, Microsoft hoped, of increasing their market share. As stated in many places, "Despite everyone’s high hopes for Windows 8 reviving the slumping PC market, Microsoft’s operating system has exacerbated its losses instead." An average and reasonable article stating as much can be read here Did Microsoft Kill the PC Market with Windows 8? Microsoft has billions of dollars to spend. Hopefully they abandon their awful new OS and start anew with something that can legitimately compete.


 
 Interesting.  The linked article is from April, 2013.  If you bought Microsoft a year ago today and reinvested the dividends, your return would be over 45%.

 As for Windows 8, Microsoft bought Nokia's handset division and is poised to increase its already growing share of the mobile market.  The PC market has also apparently reached its bottom (from losing share to mobile devices).  Intel reports shipping record volumes of its i5 and i7 processors, for the ever thriving high end PC and server markets.  What OS will run those processors?  Overwhelmingly, Windows 8 (or 8.1).


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## Dargo

jpr62902 said:


> What OS will run those processors?  Overwhelmingly, Windows 8 (or 8.1).



Actually, most every Mac uses Intel processors now; not overwhelmingly Windows based systems.  I would venture to say that the Mac business is far more important to Intel right now than Microsoft's since Windows based systems are quickly becoming extinct.  At college campuses across the country, Mac computers are preferred by what seems to be a 100:1 vs Windows based computers but actually is really dominate over Windows by about a 10:1 margin.

Um, you may want to go back and compare what your earnings would be if you bought Apple back around 2005-6 or so when Windows clearly began falling apart at the seams.  There has been a *huge* amount of dislike for Windows with every version after XP.  Personally, I really had no problem with Windows until the advent of Windows 8.  And, as I've stated many times, (since it cost me so much because I stupidly purchased some Windows 8 products) I have completely and totally abandoned anything Windows based for life.

I sort of like to compare Windows OS to General Motors.  For a very long time I was blindly loyal to Microsoft and their OS.  Heck, for a while, you really couldn't even find commercial software supporting anything but Windows unless you had a networked Unix based setup.  Now the pendulum has swung in the opposite direction after blind loyalty only ended up costing the loyal customers endless hours of headaches due to problems with the MS product and, then, countless dollars to change to something else that would work.  My family was so blindly loyal to GM that they honestly NEVER even considered anything else.  However, after suffering from a very, very poor end product and zero after the sale support, like me, I have no relatives who would even remotely consider purchasing a new GM product.  At least Microsoft did not file bankruptcy and take tens of millions of people for tens of billions of losses in their stock holdings as well has soaking the US government for hundreds of billions in losses for stupidly bailing them out with our tax dollars.  I've worked in and around the auto industry for well over a quarter of a century and I could not possibly disagree more with the government bailing out an automaker that went under due to building a poor product, paying wages they couldn't afford and operating under poor management.  I simply have no use for Microsoft products; I do not absolutely despise them as I do GM.


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## jpr62902

Microsoft is hardly falling apart at the seams.  And unless you're in the graphics business, chances are your business network has a Windows OS.  And once they discontinue support for XP next year, 8.1 will really start to take off.


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## Dargo

I sold my computer store, but I'm not aware of hardly any businesses served by the new owners who use anything Windows based. All you have to do is Google Windows 8 and you cannot possibly say that Windows is not plummeting in customer satisfaction and, therefore, sales. 

Every larger business we served was networked with a Unix based OS or any number of alternatives instead of paying the high price demanded by Microsoft for their dying Windows based OS.  As I said previously, I hope those stuck with Windows 8 can find a way to use what they bought. Like the many long term Windows users, I strongly felt it was best to cut my losses and replace every Windows based computer and tablet with one that works well with Apple or Android operating systems.


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## Adillo303

I just read an article last week that detailed how to run Android on a Windows 8 machine. They had a step by step. I tried it, it works.

Couple years ago, I set up a completely functional machine for zero cost above hardware using Ubuntu. Think I could sell one? Nope!  What Apple has done is to make people willing to learn a new O/S. Android rode in on that wave. Unix is gaining. It doesn't really much matter. With so much going to the cloud and Chrome Books so cheap, desktop, O/S's, all of them are on the way out.

Apple is very much like the IBM PS/2. They tried to make the hardware and software and control the whole product. It didn't work then, it won't work now. Look close, they are already fading. 

Windows 8 isn't really all that different. Windows 8.1 will pretty much boot to a similar desktop to Windows 7.

Folks have loved to hate Microsoft for years. They got us here.


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