# How much weight can I "really" tow?



## squerly

I'm using a diesel GMC 2500 HD to pull a 2,000 lb trailer with a 10,000 lb tractor loaded on it, total of 12,000 lbs.  Truck is rated for 10,000 lbs max.  Aside from the expected issues of stopping, is there anything else that I should be concerned about?


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## Melensdad

Overheating/over stressing the transmission.

BTW, is the trailer rated for the tractor's weight?  Is it a 10,000# GROSS rated trailer?  That would mean the trailer + its load would equal 10,000# max.  

Typically I like to tow at least 10% under the gross ratings.  Preferably more.


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## MrLiberty

Do not under any circumstance go down hill......


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## squerly

Melensdad said:


> BTW, is the trailer rated for the tractor's weight?  Is it a 10,000# GROSS rated trailer?  That would mean the trailer + its load would equal 10,000# max.


I don't know what the trailer is rated for.  It was part of the package when I bought the tractor.  I'll check the tag when I go down to the barn tomorrow.



MrLiberty said:


> Do not under any circumstance go down hill......


That's not an option around here.  I've got 7-10 miles of 7% grade to travel just to get off the mountain.  (I think that's what the signs say.)  But either way, there's a bunch of downhill navigating to be done. I've hauled a bunch of logs down the same hill before (different trailer) and the trick is to leave early in the AM and stay in 1st or 2nd all the way down.    The diesel helps a bunch too!


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## ki0ho

Go slow ..take your time...and watch your stoping distance.......

Here in Mo....most of the HP...know what most vehicles are rated at and will pull ya over if it is clear you are way over.....and call for the scales....My jeep is rated to pull 1000 lbs...We had just bought a new pontoon..it and trailer weighed a grand total of 1089 lbs........I was seven miles from the house when pulled over......from what I have read it will cost me 5.00 per pound for the 89 lbs...plus court costs.......
Dont want to think what it would cost if I had been a pile up!!!!


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## XeVfTEUtaAqJHTqq

Probably one of the most dangerous things on the road is an over-loaded truck and trailer.  Do you have a weight distribution hitch?  Hope you aren't going far.


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## waybomb

Let's think what helpless feels like.  Going down a long 7 percent grade,  brakes start getting spongy,  then fail altogether.  You can do nothing to stop that 12000 pound load from pushing and steering you.  Now it starts swaying. And it gets worse.  Then you start to roll.


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## mla2ofus

If you have 4WD I'll recommend doing the 7% in low range. That's awfully steep for that load.
                                 Mike


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## Melensdad

mla2ofus said:


> If you have 4WD I'll recommend doing the 7% in low range. That's awfully steep for that load.
> Mike



I'd recommend he not haul that load with that truck, 4wd or not.  Its too far (20%) beyond the maximum rating and its going to be towed in very difficult conditions.  I'm sorry but that is just not safe or prudent.


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## 300 H and H

mla2ofus said:


> If you have 4WD I'll recommend doing the 7% in low range. That's awfully steep for that load.
> Mike



I agree. I am quite sure any trailer rated for a 10K load will have brakes and the truck a controller. Set it at 9 or higher btw. And tell the transmissions to be in "tow mode". I think the truck in question has an electronic engine brake that will be thus engaged. My Ford diesel does.

Good road conditions, as well as working trailer brakes are a must as well. Rock topped road face at the minimum and dry to boot. 

A skilled driver would do this easily if the conditions are favorable IMHO..

Regards, Kirk


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## mbsieg

What year truck? Look at the gcvwr. There are a lot of equipment trailers that are 14k gvw 8- lug wheels.


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## bczoom

I was wondering about the year of the truck as well.

Newer 3/4 ton are somewhere around 14K.  I was thinking the older were at 12K.  I thought the new 1/2 ton (w V8) are at 9-11K.


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## JimVT

I have a 2013 f250 diesel and a 10,000lb  pull trailer with 77000lbs load. trailer is 3800lbs my trailer tires are only rated for 10,000
 i always run in the tow setting and haven't had any problems. I run in the mountains.
 i need a heaver trailer and been thinking of a 12000lb gooseneck.

 i stopped at the ford dealer and they said my truck will pull 10,000 fine.


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## squerly

I guess I should have provided a little more info in the beginning.  It's a 2008 2500 HD Crew Cab GMC, Diesel 4X4  _6 _speed Allison w/tow mode.   Gross weight about 9,000 lbs.  The trailer has duel 6 lug axles w/trailer brakes.     All the roads I'll be traveling are well maintained paved roads.  I plan on staying in tow mode and in 1st - 2nd gear.

I've pulled a 24' enclosed car hauler for a good many years so I'm comfortable with towing.  Just never pulled anything that was over the trucks rated towing range.   

I wish I had a larger truck but I don't, and I don't want to buy another truck for the few times I may take the tractor to town for maintenance/repair.  The Kubota dealer will pick it up but damn, that's $150.00 each way.


EDIT:  I just looked up some stats online and it appears the max towing weight is 13,000 lbs, which puts me pretty close to what I'm trying to tow.  So I may not be over by much.  I think it'll be OK???


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## Alaska Snow Cat

You are definitely at the limit on the capacity of your trailer and maybe a bit over depending if the rating includes the weight of the trailer or not. The tires and rims sound a little on the light side so I would keep a close eye on those when towing. The ratings of the truck focus first on the breaking power and the Combined Gross Vehicle Weight (CGVW) is more important than the towing capacity. Braking is the #1 item to consider.

 The tongue weight is probably the most critical when it comes to handling of the truck at any speed over 40mph. Just a few inches too far aft and things can get a little "squerly". Possibly consider putting the bucket in the bed of the truck.

 I would probably tow the set up you have but if more than once or twice a year I would opt for a larger trailer for sure. Oh and a Ford too...


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## bczoom

Squerly - Are you taking this in for maintenance or do you need to take off-site to do a job?  If just going in for maintenance, can you remove the FEL and anything else you don't need to take to reduce your weight?

BTW, what's the tractor?  That thing sounds heavy...


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## squerly

bczoom said:


> Squerly - Are you taking this in for maintenance or do you need to take off-site to do a job?  If just going in for maintenance, can you remove the FEL and anything else you don't need to take to reduce your weight?
> 
> BTW, what's the tractor?  That thing sounds heavy...


I have an M7040 Kubota, 70HP, 4 wheel drive.  From what I remember it's only about 4,500 lbs so it doesn't create a problem.  It's the new KX-121-3 trackhoe that weighs in at 9,990 lbs.


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## bczoom

squerly said:


> It's the new KX-121-3 trackhoe that weighs in at 9,990 lbs.


Aww, heck.  Just put a SMV sign on it and drive it down the side of the road to your destination. 

So, it sounds like your truck is OK but what's the load rating/capacity on those trailer tires?  

My neighbor has a 10K# trailer and he put a bit too much weight on it once.  He drove it the 5 miles back to his place _without incident_.  When he got out of the truck and looked, all 4 tires were trashed and needed replaced.


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## Big Dog

There is no way a #2000 trailer should be hauling a #10000 machine PERIOD!


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## bczoom

Big Dog said:


> There is no way a #2000 trailer should be hauling a #10000 machine PERIOD!



I think he said the trailer weighs 2K#, not that it's rated at 2K# which is about the right weight for a 10K trailer. _That's about what my 7K trailer weighs_.


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## Big Dog

bczoom said:


> I think he said the trailer weighs 2K#, not that it's rated at 2K# which is about the right weight for a 10K trailer. _That's about what my 7K trailer weighs_.



That's exactly what I took it as, a trailer that weighs #2000 by itself. I stand by my comment ................ it would be neglect and crazy to try and haul a #10000 machine with a #2000 trailer. 

If something happens, the book is gonna get thrown at you and deservedly so!

10K rated trailer you still have to deduct the weight of the trailer which makes it limited to a 8K load (unless you go with a 1 ton hitch load ..... !)

It could be a 12k and even still you're on the edge.


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## 300 H and H

squerly said:


> EDIT: I just looked up some stats online and it appears the max towing weight is 13,000 lbs, which puts me pretty close to what I'm trying to tow. So I may not be over by much. I think it'll be OK???


 
 I think your good to go. Just be careful. 

 Regards, Kirk


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## Big Dog

My trailer is rated for 15K, it weights 4K. If I throw 2.5K on the hitch I can load it to 12.5K BUT that is with a 1 ton, not a 3/4 ton truck. 

It wouldn't be fun with 1 ton on a 3/4 ton truck hitch!


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## bczoom

Big Dog said:


> That's exactly what I took it as, a trailer that weighs #2000 by itself. I stand by my comment ................ it would be neglect and crazy to try and haul a #10000 machine with a #2000 trailer.


Just did a quick google search for trailers.  From one of the first sites:
http://www.sweetriverstrailers.com/equipment_trailer_12000_gvw.html

12,000# trailer
16’ (14’ flat + 2’ Dovetail)
Weighs 2,300#

7000# trailer
16’ (14’ flat + 2’ Dovetail)
Weighs 1,920#

I wonder how much is different.  Pretty much axles and tires?  7K axles as opposed to 3.5K, tires are 16" load range E as opposed to 15" load range C.


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## squerly

Took pics of these stickers on the side of the trailer and it looks to be built to handle a total of 10K lbs.  The trailer weighs 2K so I can haul another 8K for a total of 10K.   I called the manufacture and he said that he doesn't feel it's safe but people haul 12K on them all the time with no issues.  

Given that my trailer is almost brand new (has less than 100 miles on it) I can probably get $2,500.00 for it.  The trailer guy sells a 20' trailer (8 lug axle's) rated at 12K lbs for $3,600 so I'll just make up the difference and have a trailer with the proper rating.

This project surprised me in that I expected the truck to be the weak link and it turned out to be the trailer.  But I don't mind having a heaver duty trailer.  It's my experience that good equipment holds its value well and I don't expect this to be any different.

Thank you everyone for your input, it's greatly appreciated.


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## mbsieg

Wish you were closer that's the trailer I am looking for......... here that trailer is 1-1.5k more.


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## squerly

mbsieg said:


> Wish you were closer that's the trailer I am  looking for......... here that trailer is 1-1.5k more.


OK, well here are some more pics, just in case you decide to drive another 1,500 miles...


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## it's all about downhill

You will like pulling down hill with that GM/Allison combination. When I did it the trailer mode was scary, each time I hit the brakes it would shift down. didn't matter that I was already at 2500 RPM. That thing would push up to 5000 RPM in a heart beat, and boy did it. I found a more harmonious outcome by using the manual shift mode. Start one or two gears lower than you think you need. If it's doing a good job of holding back, then you can shift up, no problem. I did Cabbage Hill east of Pendleton OR @~20000 and no white knuckles at all.
Last week (thanks to glacierparkbus) I found myself descending White Bird hill in Idaho (7 miles 10 or 11percent grade) with 24700 pounds. '97 Cummins NV4500 B D exhaust brake 2nd gear held nicely. I had just put the B-D on for this trip and am very happy with it. Held the RPM to 1500 easily (~15 MPH) I did the math... 7 miles at 15 MPH is an all day project. The exhaust brake may be a good help for your GM. They warm the engine leaving the ski resort and save brakes too. You may not need it with that Alison though. Let us know how you do. 

Notes:
1) I'll assume that there is an extra "0" in post #13
2) sno-drifter often reminds me "1000 times down the hill too slow, one time too fast"  YMMV


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## Helmsman38

Melensdad said:


> Overheating/over stressing the transmission.
> 
> BTW, is the trailer rated for the tractor's weight?  Is it a 10,000# GROSS rated trailer?  That would mean the trailer + its load would equal 10,000# max.
> 
> Typically I like to tow at least 10% under the gross ratings.  Preferably more.



 Correct me if I have this wrong  but that's assuming that the 4-tires on two axels have a minimum rating of 2500 PSI = 10,000 pounds load rating and same thing with tires you want the rating to be higher that the expected load. Sidewall rating E trailer rated tires would be nice  

Always come come at the end of the day otherwise it wasn't worth the trip !


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