# Needing some advice:  Mattracks for remote cabin access?



## Cletis

Hello all, we recently just purchased some remote mountain property that only has seasonal access.  We plan on living there yr rd.  I need something the wife would be comfortable driving.  I've snowmobiled the road in the winter, 2 miles long with some steep grades.  I was thinking the mattracks or American truck tracks would be fine on a jeep. If one would stay on the road it should compact as time goes by.

So do you think the mattracks or ATTracks would work fine in that application even with some steep grades?

Thank you  Cletis


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## Blackfoot Tucker

I'm a Sno Cat guy, and have never driven a vehicle with Mattracks, so take what I say with a grain of salt. (I'll use the term Mattrack to describe all vehicles with an aftermarket track set-up.)

Here in northern Utah we can get dumped on with several feet of powder. I've been snowmobiling, stepped off the sled, and literally sunk almost up to my waist (I'm 6'3"). In those conditions Mattracks would be absolutely worthless. The snow here can be very, very light, whereas in other parts of the country their snow is much heavier and more dense.

Here's a link to a youtube video of a Tucker in deep snow. Listen to the  comment at 1:30.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5xymCB2i-Q&feature=related"]YouTube- going up dyer big storm 2010 tucker sno cat[/ame]  

Every single picture I have seen of a Mattrack equipped vehicle shows them either in not much snow, or on a well packed trail, or both, and all have been on flat terrain. I have never seen a photo of a Mattrack equipped vehicle in deep snow, climbing a hill.

The "creature comforts" of an SUV are far better than those of one of my Tuckers. But having said that, I find the Tuckers very easy to drive. Mine have manual transmissions, but one with an automatic transmission would be even easier to drive.


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## snow dog

Cletis,
My concern for you is your description of " Steep Grades". Operating a over the snow vehicle can be tricky on steep grades. Many roads often cross steep sections and when the snow falls the road becomes impassable with out plowing it flat or going someother way so that you vehicle is not sliding sideways. Maybe you could post some photos of your road or be more specific at to where your at.  I am sure what ever you decide on will be a learning experience for you and the wife. Many hours will be necessary to feel comfortable driving your road year round


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## jo5

The only times I've seen mattrack in heavy snow it had my snow cat hooked too it Same with your american truck when it fell off the paced trail I think there fine in there place But wouldn't work for me  I go about 3.5 miles in to my cabin an even if the roads packed The snow ,wind,drifts will kill you I'd get a small snow cat with a auto trans and teach your wife too drive it Then you won't have to worry (as much )


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## Cletis

Thanks all for the replies.  The area is Bondurant, WYoming.  The area usually gets at least 12ft and can get 2-3 over night.  There are two steep hills one about 100' long and the other about 50'.  The road will usually compact to about 4ft.  I had thought that with daily compaction the Mattracks or ATTrucks might work on a jeep but the wife has to be able to drive this vehicle. 

Cletis


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## Snowtrac Nome

you might look into a snow trac they are old and good ones that don't need to be rebuilt are comanding a high price but they are simple to drive if you follow some simple rules and will travel through the deepest snow with ease. here is a novel idea mattracks work great on packed trails around here they run them up and down the snowmachine trils all the time get teh mattracks for your wife convince her you need the snow cat to break trail.


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## mtntopper

You may want to review my prior thread on the ATT tracked Jimmy SUV's. 

http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/showthread.php?t=34340

When commuting on the same road or snow trails the tracked SUV 4X4's work very well at much less cost and maintenance than a snow cat. We are now using our tracked 4X4 vehicles in place of the snow cat and Mattrack truck 98% of the time at much less cost. The ATT tracked SUV 4X4 shortens the time of the commute to half of what it takes for a snow cat and uses 1/3 the fuel with a lot more comfort. If in doubt when we have the heavy 3 foot wet spring snows I will pack the road/trail with the snow machine or the snow cat but that is very seldom needed and done more as a precaution. A snow machine can do the packing required in a short time. I use my snow cat for the cross country climb to the top of the mountain adventures and seldom as a commuter vehicle anymore. My bulk fuel tanks of 650+ gallons of fuel are half full this year where in the past they were almost empty by spring when I used the snow cat exclusively.

A snow cat has its place and purpose but for many users the tracked SUV is a great alternative vehicle. The ATT tracked SUV will surprise you on how well it does over the snow, overall less costly in repairs, the ease of finding parts, better fuel mileage along with the ease of operation and creature comfort available in an SUV type vehicle. The cost of buying a good SUV and equipping with tracks is probably going to be much less expensive than buying a good used ready to use snow cat which is just an added bonus.


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## Snowtrac Nome

i still think both snow cat for the mister and matttracks for the mrs.break a trail with the cat and use the jeep the only problems the locals have had with mattracks have been crust covered snow seems to drag the track under till it spins out one guy put lockers front and rear claims to have solved his problem.they all stay away from snow covered willows with the snow trac i'm about the only one who will venture accross them


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## mtntopper

I don't want to bust your bubble Don but the weight of the Mattracks (approx 450lbs each pod) is a problem area compared to the much lighter weight of the ATT tracks (approx 150lbs per pod) which on a Blazer or Jimmy type vehicle will float much better thru the snow than the Mattrack equipped larger vehicles.....I own both so I can say this with knowledge and complete confidence as to the difference in the two track systems. Mattracks are over engineered, built very well for commercial and industrial use but cost too much for the average user. The ATT track systems are about 1/3 or less than the cost of Mattracks and just make good sense compared to the Mattracks for most people. My Jimmy's weigh in about 4300 lbs while the larger F250 has to be pushing over 7000+ lbs with the Mattracks installed while the foot print is about equal between the two. We used the Mattracks very little since we set the Jimmys up for over snow with the ATT track system.


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## Snowtrac Nome

you didn't bust my bubble i just use mattracks to reference pod type track systems also that is all that is up here right now as stated i have entertained a pod type track system for my old cj-5 after i do the frame up restoration on it just because its always nice to have an ace in the hole when you have a piece of equipment as specilized as the snow trac and for summer use the podd tracs would ford much deeper rivers  than a snow trac.


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## Melensdad

mtntopper, The ATT tracks look nice and light with a clean design.  That strong central vertical support pillar appears to carry all the weight and then spread it down to the bogie wheels/track.  Nice design, simple.  It looks about as easy to change over from tires as simply removing the bolts and slapping them on.  

Any changes with the suspension needed when shifting from wheels to ATT tracks?


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## Snowtrac Nome

Melensdad said:


> mtntopper, The ATT tracks look nice and light with a clean design. That strong central vertical support pillar appears to carry all the weight and then spread it down to the bogie wheels/track. Nice design, simple. It looks about as easy to change over from tires as simply removing the bolts and slapping them on.
> 
> Any changes with the suspension needed when shifting from wheels to ATT tracks?


ditto i like the simplicity even if there is a ride quality price to pay


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## Mtn-Track

These tracked SUV's are a great toy, but in no way a reliable snow transportation vehicle. I've passed many while on my snowmobile or in my Cat that managed to get rather far up the mountain on the well-packed snowmobile trails. Every one of them had dropped two tracks off the trail to let others by and there they were...., buried and abandoned. There is a very good reason why nobody can show pic's or video of the tracked SUV's cutting trail in deep snow or pulling hills; they won't do it! Simply do the math on the weight vs. track area of any 'purpose-built' snow machine and then do the same for a tracked-SUV. You'll see the track-conversion limitations.


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## Snowtrac Nome

Mtn-Track said:


> These tracked SUV's are a great toy, but in no way a reliable snow transportation vehicle. I've passed many while on my snowmobile or in my Cat that managed to get rather far up the mountain on the well-packed snowmobile trails. Every one of them had dropped two tracks off the trail to let others by and there they were...., buried and abandoned. There is a very good reason why nobody can show pic's or video of the tracked SUV's cutting trail in deep snow or pulling hills; they won't do it! Simply do the math on the weight vs. track area of any 'purpose-built' snow machine and then do the same for a tracked-SUV. You'll see the track-conversion limitations.


you also have to remember the orsional force of the forward section of the track will want to rotate down when under load if you spin the track it will dig fast in the front than the same on the rear when backing up


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## mbsieg

guess I shoulda been stuck then. vaguely remember pics of a Tucker terra stuck when it fell off the side of the trail around here somewhere... Hmmmmmmmmmm. Maybe that is saying you can get anything stuck... I bet the almighty snot track and snot masters have even been stuck before. Oh wait that could have never happened. Hmmmm, I bet there are pics around here somewhere.


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## mattfidaho

but this was a BIG tucker, our 2000XL drove all around where they were... they were shocked when I just turned and went up the hill to get around them.... 

they had a lot more weight with all the stuff, along with the added weight from the 2000. 

not sure if this is what you were thinking of..

And I have used the mattracks (littlefoot?) and other track systems on ATV and UTVs but I have never messed with a full sized 4X4.


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## Snowtrac Nome

I havn't got my snot track stuck yet ,it has how ever amazed me where it will go even been in aeras that have left snow machines stuck.i don't know why they were stuck could have been operator error ,if you want some thing stuck or broke give it to a GI nothing is impossoble, and a little common sence goes along way also snow conditions have a lot to do with what works best. the snow that pod tracks work best on arn't the best for my snot trac, and the snot trac isn't quiet or comfotable but it does do the job cheep . podd tracks will greatly enhance the capibilitys of a conventional vehicle,  as a final note i think a podd tracked suv will go just about any plase you can take a bv 206 with the exception of  some hills, but i willl admit i have had no stick time behind them so i can only coment on what i have seen around here and whatshort commings  the owners have comented on most guys around here state that a selectable locker is the best insurance to get outof a bad situation


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## mbsieg

mattfidaho said:


> but this was a BIG tucker, our 2000XL drove all around where they were... they were shocked when I just turned and went up the hill to get around them....
> 
> they had a lot more weight with all the stuff, along with the added weight from the 2000.
> 
> not sure if this is what you were thinking of..
> 
> And I have used the mattracks (littlefoot?) and other track systems on ATV and UTVs but I have never messed with a full sized 4X4.



Nope not that pic guess you have lockers though I have first hand experiance with both they both have there place. Yes they ATT will easily climb in 3-4ft of powder. We will not tell Mtntopper that though......


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## Snowtrac Nome

nothing s idiot proof some rigs maybe more forgiving than others one must understand what is going on under their rig and unlike tires or a snowmachine it dosn't sound like spinning the tracks will help with a little caution i would expect they will work ok i still think the best option is get the little lady to buy off on a cat for the man and pod tracks for the lady that way the guy has a toy and the lady can commute may have to buy her something shinny to get her to let you spend that kind of money.


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## mtntopper

More Tucker Terra Stuck!!!!!!!!!

Without lockers the two tracks on the high side had no weight on them and just spun while the two on the low side just kept sinking in deeper. You do not get your real snow cat operator's badge/license until you can successfully stick one and under the right circumstances you can stick any snow cat as they are not invincible. I would not call sticking one always operator error so much as just circumstances beyond your control that sometimes will win out in the end.......

And I am sure my LMC's and Thiokol two tracks would of walked thru here without any problems or would of they as we will never know for sure as they were not here and did not encounter the same conditions, circumstances or timing of the Tucker in the pics..... We will never know for sure and I really don't give a shit...as what works for one is a total disaster for another.......


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## mtntopper

Even two track all mighty 1200 LMCs can get stuck.....This one does not have paddles big enough to swim......Another snow cat operator's badge/license well earned!!!!!!!!

Operator error or just circumstances??????????? The blame game is easy until you are sitting in the operators seat. None of these pics are of me. I earned my license/badge and sure as hell will not posts my own pics since I was the only one to see the pitiful Piston Bully not moving anymore..........


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## Snowtrac Nome

i've always been pretty consertive when bounding around in a snow cat because i'm the guy called to get them un stuck,i know what kind of work is involved i almoste laid a bv206 on it's side while in the military and just this winter after spending all winter and lots of hours in the light little snow trac i almost did it with another bv 206 again. weight is your enemy and foot print is your friend lockers are to get you out of a bad situation not  to push you further than you should go


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## Alaska Snow Cat

Mtntopper puts it best on getting stuck. Two track, four track, this brand, that brand, doesn't matter they can all get stuck. How well a person learns the good habits or bad habits of a specific cat as well as how good they are at reading the snow combined with experience, patience, mechanical ability and luck will all contribute to the success of the operation.

 Having lived the off road life style for many years and run a snowcat business for even more years, my advice to Cletis would be to invest in two new wide track utility snowmobiles before investing in a snowcat. The snowmobile is a must have tool for remote living in snow country while the snowcat is very convenient and accomplishes certain tasks with greater ease and comfort. If I had to choose between the two I would choose the snowmobile without a question, I'm just thankful I don't have to make that choice as I love my snowcats and plan on driving one to the Pearly Gates when that day comes.

  Cletis, there probably is no real good answer to your question except the answer you will discover as you move forward with your plans. In a perfect world you would have one snowcat of each brand  as well as the track conversions for the truck and SUV so there would be no snow you could not concur and control. Unfortunately there is a limit to a guys wallet and you need to remember to save some for the dozer, excavator, 4 wheels, boat, airplane oh and that rusty old snowcat you saw in the weeds over on that dirt road going to.... What town was that?


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## Snowtrac Nome

money wise i would have to concure with alaska snow cat t snogoes with a good freight sled (another debate what is the fest freighter) for a 2 mile driveway is the best it's just you and your wife i bought the snow trac because i now have 2 teens 1 pre teen and a 5 year old the younger kids wont tell you they are getting cold they are having too much fun and at 8k per sled + gas things are getting expensive to move the family and a trip for me can be 5 hours and 5 hours back but even a 1 hour hop with a day of ice fishing you can imagin screeeming cold kids or some one getting frost bite when a storm comes in i vote go with the sleds and see if you cant get some guys with other options ttake you out and se what works best in your area and fits your budget


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## fogtender

The Imp is a pretty good for what you are talking about, it can go in deep snow and has a low center of gravity for getting around...

Can't believe I got over 18,000 hits on this!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xw2iQ92uA_U


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## Blackfoot Tucker

Alaska Snow Cat said:


> ... my advice to Cletis would be to invest in two new wide track utility snowmobiles before investing in a snowcat. The snowmobile is a must have tool for remote living in snow country while the snowcat is very convenient and accomplishes certain tasks with greater ease and comfort. If I had to choose between the two I would choose the snowmobile without a question, I'm just thankful I don't have to make that choice as I love my snowcats and plan on driving one to the Pearly Gates when that day comes.



I'm surprised by your comments. 

My girlfriend's parents live in a remote location and have two snowmobiles for winter access. Her Dad turns 81 and her Mom turns 76 this year. Their snowmobiles are the only means they have of getting in and out during the worst of the winter. 

Suppose they go to a friend's house for dinner? (They do that frequently.) After dinner they will have to snowmobile their way back in to their place. If something happens and they get stuck, to put it simply; they're in a potential survival situation. Due to their age, they may not have the strength to get their sleds unstuck. And, when you add the dark of night and the cold temperatures, well... it could get ugly.

I think a Sno Cat ( a good one) is less likely to get stuck to begin with, but even if it does, it will offer protection from the wind and, assuming you can run the engine, keep you warm. Additionally, it has the space to carry sleeping bags, food, etc. 

I really think it's a much safer option. In fact, my plan is to build a place not to far from theirs, and I'll use a Sno Cat (and I have a very capable snowmobile).


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## Snowtrac Nome

i think thats sound advice for a 2 mile drive they are affordable and pretty tough but not impossible to get a bear cat stuck also if one was to break down you can double up to get home if you break or stigk a snow cat you are walking or camping for long trips with the family my st is just right pile on survivle gear and go for access to a house off the road it has great cool factor but would not be cost effective if i couldn't have rebuilt it my self and also kudos to all members who helped with technical info i could not have gotten any where else. most people who live outof the road service aera here use snomachines and sleds quite sucessfuly for access i'm not certain where he lives the podd tracks might work good on a packed trail i know around here they work good on snowmachine trails if i went with cat i would look for somethig small like a imp or snow trac but i would think twice about a bombi there is no room no cargo capicity and deep snow preformance isn't all that great. personel experiance i don't want to start another heated discussion. the best advice i can give to him is talk to the local people see what works best there.


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## Alaska Snow Cat

Ok, now we have here a real good conversation about snow cat use and it's 76 degrees outside. I like it. First I don't disagree with anything that has been said on this thread but I do think the more a person new to off road living hears the better off they will be. I see it time and time again, in my neck of the woods, when people are going to live the bush life style without a real clue as to all the difficulties. It takes a tremendous amount of preparation and there is a huge learning curve if they are to succeed. I would honestly have to say at least 90% of the folks who give it a try living off road around here don't even make it two years. It's lonely, hard, frustrating and never ending work. I prefer it.

On the access issue I was saying "first" get the snowmobiles, they are by far the best over the snow mode of transportation in most situations and there is not one single person in my community that does not have one, if they live off road, even the die hard greenies have this "tool" as they call it. There are only 5 snowcats in a 30 mile radius that I can think of( I've got an eye for these things) and I own 3 of them. One of the others I use to own and it sits idle and in disrepair because the owners didn't relise what it takes to keep one in working condition. The other one sits idle in the guys yard and has not moved once in the 3 years he has owned it. This is a very popular winter recreation area, for Alaska, and there are hundreds of remote cabins with a good sprinkling of homes.

 It baffles me there aren't more snow cats used around here, or in Alaska in general, but they are far and few between but the snowmobile is a whole other issue. One thing I think a person who is new to snowcats needs to understand is that they are generally unreliable. That's right I said, it but let me explain what I mean. For MOST people they are unreliable unless you luck out and get one that is fairly new(unlikely) or has just been rebuilt by someone who know what they were doing. Then you must keep up with the maintenance and repairs or they quickly become unreliable. I compare them to a airplane that mated with a boat.

 Every single snowcat I have owned (7) has needed to be completely disassembled, repaired, parts replaced and reassembled to be reliable. 3 of them I bought from reputable factory dealers from out of state and was guaranteed they were ready to work when in reality they were ready to be work on. I owned 2 bombies, loved and worked them like no other. I had a 76 Spryte and it would be high on my list of access cats. The others are the big alpine cats that I use for contract grooming and it takes 3 of them to keep 1 and 1/2 going.

 As far as safety due to break downs any machine is only as reliable as the owner keeps it and the factory made it. I carry the essential survival gear on both my snowmobile and snowcat permanently, never leave the yard without it. A broken down snowcat becomes a cold snowcat very quickly. Unfortunately I have seen people walk away( and some die) from stuck or broken machinery when if they had the knowledge to fix or get unstuck would have been home sleeping in a warm bed. If you are not mechanically inclined I would not recommend a snowcat as a primary mode of transportation unless your neighbor is running a snowcat repair business. Snowmobiles can be bought new, with a warranty and the dealers are usually not too far away, once you get to the road that is.

 I actually think Cletis's idea of a tracked truck/suv(hybrid) would be a good way to go if he used a snowmobile or snowcat to groom his trail after a deep snow. He could also groom with the hybrid while it is snowing or after light snows with good results. The key to a good trail wether used by cats or snowmobiles is keeping a good base and then keeping on that base and that sometimes requires having more tools than beer.


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## Snowtrac Nome

Ak snow cat you got points for that so true around here we have 1 bv206 runs good but expensive i maintain it my snow trac also runs and has been darn near rebuillt new engine and trans varriator belt seals and the list goes on member randy has 2 thiokols 601's run good still needs some tlc they only move during hunting season theres a bombadier rattrack more snow tracs a skidozer and a bunch of old muskeg carriers and of all thosecats only 4 are running and only 2 ever leave town unless being trailered to a trail head once a year you can get a good snow cat or get a good price verry seldom do you get both a snow cat in good condition is un beatable finding people that can get them reliable isn't so easy your standard auto mechanic usualy won't cut the mustard most don't even know what points are any more.


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## Blackfoot Tucker

I wish it were 76 degrees outside... We had a lousy snow year during the  winter and now we're having an unusually wet and cold spring.

AK  Snow Cat, you've lived the remote lifestyle and I haven't. My  observations come largely from talking to my girlfriend's parents and  witnessing their difficulties.

A couple of years ago they got one  of their snowmobiles stuck. The trail had drifted-in quite a bit and  there was a section where you really had to be careful with the sled's  balance. Well, once it didn't work out so well and the snowmobile went  over the downhill bank about 10 yards. It stayed there until spring when  a neighbor with a winch on his Jeep came by and pulled it back out. 

The  access to my property is what I'll call an "improved logging road".  It's not very wide, and it's cut into a fairly steep hillside. There's  one section where it's right next to some cliffs above the road and  usually that area drifts-in quite a bit. The drifts tend to follow the  shape of the original topography so it ends up being a pretty steep  hillside.

I snowmobile a fair amount every winter and go with a  group of guys who are all very good riders. Our riding is almost all  boondocking and minimal trail riding, so side-hilling is something I'm  very familiar with. With all that said, I wouldn't want to sidehill  across that drifted-in area by the cliffs. Not only is it steep and  narrow, but if things don't go well you are off the edge and into the  trees. And, when we snowmobile, it's just rider and machine. We never  tow a cargo  sled with food, supplies, etc (which would be a necessity for remote  living) and complicate the sidehill  crossing.

A Sno Cat with a 6-way front blade allows one to cut a  more level path across that area.

100% of my Sno Cat experience  is with Tuckers, so I can't speak to any other brand. I have found the  vast majority of parts readily available at NAPA. If I need something  else, I have found Tucker to be excellent at shipping parts promptly,  and similarly generous in providing advice when needed. Mechanically, I  think they are very simple machines. A Chrysler Industrial engine is  very basic, as are New Process transmissions and Dana 60 axles. If a  mechanic can't figure one of those out they shouldn't be called a  mechanic.

Unfortunately though, as these machines age they have  usually had several owners who don't have a clue. For example, one of  mine was previously owned by a forum member who claimed the carriers had  all been rebuilt. Well, that was bull plop. They were in atrocious  shape and hundreds of dollars and dozens of hours later the carriers  have all been overhauled. Almost everywhere I looked I found slipshod  work. 

My career has been in aviation and my experience with my  employers has been they are rigorous in their preventive maintenance and  when something does break, it's fixed properly. I adhere to that  philosophy and am amazed by the absolutely pathetic "repairs" I've seen  done to Sno Cats. It's no wonder they break when they aren't taken care  of and not fixed properly.


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## mtntopper

Alaska Snow Cat said:


> I actually think Cletis's idea of a tracked truck/suv(hybrid) would be a good way to go if he used a snowmobile or snowcat to groom his trail after a deep snow. He could also groom with the hybrid while it is snowing or after light snows with good results. The key to a good trail wether used by cats or snowmobiles is keeping a good base and then keeping on that base and that sometimes requires having more tools than beer.


 
Excellent and this is what works great........use the same road/trail and keep it packed for the best results for any snow vehicle....I also put up trail marker stakes to know exactly where my snow trails are in the open wind blown areas and then I can find and know I am on my snow trail in blizzard conditions. 

We utilize utility type wide track Arctic Bearcat snowmobiles, ATT tracked Jimmy's, F250 with Mattracks, a UTV Yamaha Rhino with tracks, SV200 Bombardier grooming snow cat and a family Thiokol Super Imp multi passenger cat with an 8 way front blade for cutting side hills and drift busting. Each over snow vehicle has it's limitations but also a useful purpose depending on what you need and want to use when you learn to use it properly.....

As to the "remote living" it is a tough learning experience/adventure when your nearest neighbor is 12 miles away and he is even less prepared than you for the lifestyle and depends on you to bail his ass out. We have learned to be prepared and expect the worst and are thankful it usually turns out not nearly that bad. We have lived remotely 28 miles from the nearest town, 12 miles from the nearest neighbor at 8500 foot elevation in the mountains of Wyoming, seen the "wanna be's" and "big talkers" come and go as they cannot adjust to the realities of the remote lifestyle and its hardships for about 7 years now......


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## Cletis

Seems really stupid that Tucker does not come with lockers as standard equipment.  I'm sure they are options on new machines.

They do flag the sides of the road all the way back.  There is a community parking lot where everyone changes to the road rigs.  There is usually a Thiokol and a jeep with Mattracks sitting there and some kind of really usless looking thing with really small tracks and a canvas cab that looks like a one person rig.  The rest are snowmobiles.

Why do you think more cats are not made similar to a Tucker with four tracks and lockers?  

As far as off the packed road in deep powder snow cating, is lighter always better?


Cletis


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## mattfidaho

Cletis said:


> Seems really stupid that Tucker does not come with lockers as standard equipment.  I'm sure they are options on new machines.
> 
> They do flag the sides of the road all the way back.  There is a community parking lot where everyone changes to the road rigs.  There is usually a Thiokol and a jeep with Mattracks sitting there and some kind of really usless looking thing with really small tracks and a canvas cab that looks like a one person rig.  The rest are snowmobiles.
> 
> Why do you think more cats are not made similar to a Tucker with four tracks and lockers?
> 
> As far as off the packed road in deep powder snow cating, is lighter always better?
> 
> 
> Cletis


all of the 2000 xl have lockers standard.... and that is the light weight mountain top cat... utility access.  the big heavy groomers it looks like it is an option on them... my guess is they would be working trails and would have less need for a locker?

http://www.sno-cat.com/SectionIndex.asp?SectionID=6


track size vs weight in powder off the trail... light is better but you also need track size to give you the flotation.


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## mattfidaho

also different cats for different jobs.. a 2 track will turn on a dime, but you also lose traction either breaking or less power on the side to turn, but a 4 track they are all still full power but you cant flip it around in your own tracks. 
 I do wonder if tucker has the patent or something on the 4 track crab steer? I know lame tracks are close but they pivot in the middle of vs. having the tracks pivot under the cat. 

I run both for work and search and rescue. and there is benefits to both types.


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## Cletis

Don't know if Tucker would be able to patent the four track crab steer feature.

Different equipment has been around for years with crab steer like a Telehandler.

Cletis


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## mattfidaho

Cletis said:


> Don't know if Tucker would be able to patent the four track crab steer feature.
> 
> Different equipment has been around for years with crab steer like a Telehandler.
> 
> Cletis




true, 
and maybe it would be too much of a totally new design for a company who builds 2 track to go to a 4.


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## NorthernRedneck

mattfidaho said:


> also different cats for different jobs.. a 2 track will turn on a dime, but you also lose traction either breaking or less power on the side to turn, but a 4 track they are all still full power but you cant flip it around in your own tracks.
> I do wonder if tucker has the patent or something on the 4 track crab steer? I know lame tracks are close but they pivot in the middle of vs. having the tracks pivot under the cat.
> 
> I run both for work and search and rescue. and there is benefits to both types.



I've run both a tucker 2000 and a lamtrack.  Personally, I'd take the lamtrack over the tucker any day.  With it pivoting in the middle vs the tucker setup, you don't get that "Shit, I'm falling off the trail" feeling you get with the tucker.  Am  saying that they don't get stuck.  No.  Anything will get stuck if you try hard enough.  The lamtrack will also maintain better traction going over rough terrain due to the pivoting and articulating in the middle.


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## Alaska Snow Cat

Cletis said:


> As far as off the packed road in deep powder snow cating, is lighter always better?
> 
> 
> Cletis



Lighter foot print is usually better. You can have a #10,000 machine that goes better than a #3000 machine because it has wider tracks and therefor less ground pressure. Of course the type of cleats, horse power and transmission will all play a part in the overall performance in deep snow.

I'd start my decision process by figuring out the maximum width you can use for your trail and woods and considering if you plan on trailering it or not. Next I would consider if you want the flatbed capabilities, plow, pintle hitch, number of passangers etc. 

Price can vary a lot so that may narrow your search right off the bat. An Imp and a LMC 1500 are basically the same class of snowcat but the prices are quite different as are the creature comforts. Newer Tuckers hold their value and typically go for over $50,000. Pisten Bully makes several small utility snowcats that are the cadillacs of the industry but are out of most peoples price range.


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## Snowtrac Nome

Alaska Snow Cat said:


> Lighter foot print is usually better. You can have a #10,000 machine that goes better than a #3000 machine because it has wider tracks and therefor less ground pressure. Of course the type of cleats, horse power and transmission will all play a part in the overall performance in deep snow.
> 
> I'd start my decision process by figuring out the maximum width you can use for your trail and woods and considering if you plan on trailering it or not. Next I would consider if you want the flatbed capabilities, plow, pintle hitch, number of passangers etc.
> 
> Price can vary a lot so that may narrow your search right off the bat. An Imp and a LMC 1500 are basically the same class of snowcat but the prices are quite different as are the creature comforts. Newer Tuckers hold their value and typically go for over $50,000. Pisten Bully makes several small utility snowcats that are the cadillacs of the industry but are out of most peoples price range.


 you guys foorgot about the vw powered rigs snow trac snow master and kristi these are all priced verry affordable and a snow trac with its unique steering systen will go just about any place you need to go the snow master just does it better until you have to trailer it it' 6 inches too wide in most states and requires an oversize permit. snow tracks have a fully enclosed cabin and seat 6 kind of tight than there are always a kristi they are kind of unique and not some thing i would normaly recomend and even though it looks like an orange bathtub if you could pick up a unit that had been rebuilt like BigAl's i wouldn't be afraid of it.


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