# Hydraulic Top Link vs Top-N-Tilt



## Melensdad

Well I gave up on my hydraulic Top-n-Tilt system and now am using simply a hydraulic top link.

2 reasons, the imported 4 way joystick valve failed (again) and I didn't feel like spending the rest of the summer and most of the fall trying to get another one of those valves.  Not even sure who makes them, but there is apparently only one source for them (Carter & Carter Machine) and they typically have them on backorder 

The main reason is that I really only used the top link in practical use.  basically I got about 90+% of the value and use out of the Top Link.  In fact I am amazed at how useful that addition to the tractor really is for so many different implements.  I've you've never used one, I probably can't even explain how much more useful a hydraulic top link can make a box blade or landscape rake with its ability to micro-adjust the angle of the implement for a more or less aggressive bit, while you are in the middle of a pass.  

The hoses and controls are now much simpler, which is a bit of a bonus, getting rid of the 4 way joystick eliminated 4 of the 6 extra hoses.  It also eliminated the need to have a special mount attached to my ROPS that held the valve, etc.

Anyone want a short hydraulic cylinder with a piloted check valve?


----------



## Doc

So Bob, for someone who has never tried top n tilt or a hydro top link what is the difference?
I'm assuming the hydro top link just lifts up and down while the top and tilt can vary the top link up down, to either side, and forward and back.  6 ways.  

Since all I can do with my box blade is up and down manually I can imagine how handy that would be to be able to do that from the seat.

What is the cost difference for the two?


----------



## Melensdad

TNT systems let you use a joystick (or a 2 lever system) to control the length of the top link, and also allow you to TILT the implement from side to side.  

The Hydraulic Top Link only allows you to control the length of the top link.

However, until you try it, you really don't know how useful it is.  A box blade can become TWICE as aggressive or can be made to BARELY bite by simple adjustment of the hydraulic control.  This is very effective when trying to change the slope of mound.  It is far more than just raising or lower the 3pt, because it changes the angle of the bite.  Using a Landscape Rake you can set it to scrape sticks off your lawn, or to bite down hard enough to tear up sod, depending on your needs.  

Similarly with a corn planter, I found it works best when it is adjusted perfectly, something that is easy to do when you are driving the tractor and watching the Planter work. But something that is hard to guess when you are standing behind the tractor, adjusting the manual toplink, then test driving, then adjusting, then test driving, then adjusting . . . 

The TILT function, that is added when you install a TNT system, gives you a lot of functionality if you are trying to do things like dig long narrow ditches in a flat field for drainage, etc (but my blades, rakes also have tilt function).  The tilt function gives you on-the-fly control to shape the crown of a gravel road, etc.  

I just found for my uses, the tilt control was not used very much, but the hydraulic adjustment of the toplink was very useful. So when my joystick valve broke, I simply notched my system down to a hydraulic toplink and eliminated the EXTRA valve from the tractor.


----------



## BigAl RIP

I agree bob that once you have it installed you will never go back to manul adjustment .I never really used my top link adjustment  a lot until this year when I was building some new roads on the ranch using a rear angle blade . Makes an amazing difference .having the ""in seat ability to adjust the cutting angle and sure speeds up the progress .


----------



## Dargo

I've actually been looking for a "tilt" cylinder for my T&T system since my cylinders do not have check valves.  For some reason, it really doesn't seem to matter much on the top cylinder, but I'm *always* f'ing with the tilt to re-adjust it from where it has leaked down.    If you have the standard short stroke double check valve cylinder setup for the "tilt", how much do you want for it?


----------



## DaveNay

How difficult is it to remove?  Do they have QD connectors inline on the hoses, or would they need to be added?  I use my PHD a lot, which requires the removal of the top link completely.  Perhaps a set of brackets to the side to "hang" the top cylinder from when I need the PHD?


----------



## Melensdad

DaveNay said:


> How difficult is it to remove?  Do they have QD connectors inline on the hoses, or would they need to be added?  I use my PHD a lot, which requires the removal of the top link completely.  Perhaps a set of brackets to the side to "hang" the top cylinder from when I need the PHD?


Dave, when I "replumbed" my system this weekend I installed QD connectors on the cylinder.  I already had QD on the tractor and on the hose end that connects to the tractor.  So now I have QD connectors on both ends of the hose, on the top link and on the tractor.



Dargo said:


> I've actually been looking for a "tilt" cylinder for my T&T system since my cylinders do not have check valves. For some reason, it really doesn't seem to matter much on the top cylinder, but I'm *always* f'ing with the tilt to re-adjust it from where it has leaked down.    If you have the standard short stroke double check valve cylinder setup for the "tilt", how much do you want for it?


Brent, mine does have the "double piloted check valve" on the cylinder.

I'd be happy to sell it to you but I would want you to make sure the tilt cylinder is long enough for your tractor.  Why don't you take some measurements of your side link to see what "minimum length" and what "fully extended" length you would need and/or want.  If you give me those dimensions I can hook mine up, extend it and retract it and take some measurements to see if the cylinder would work for you.  

Another possible alternative would be for you to disassemble my tilt cylinder and install the check valve system on your cylinder.  That would take some work.  Maybe have to have a shop install it for you?


----------



## OhioTC18 RIP

I have never used the tilt cylinder, just the top link. I don't know how they can sell a tractor without one.


----------



## Hay DR

Dargo said:


> I've actually been looking for a "tilt" cylinder for my T&T system since my cylinders do not have check valves. For some reason, it really doesn't seem to matter much on the top cylinder, but I'm *always* f'ing with the tilt to re-adjust it from where it has leaked down.  If you have the standard short stroke double check valve cylinder setup for the "tilt", how much do you want for it?


****** has new custom side-link cylinders with the double piloted check valves.


----------

