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Why all the New Provactions in the Middle East?

FrancSevin

FrancSevin

Proudly Deplorable
Has anyone thought about the motivations, the " why" of Iran's current bellicose campaign of terrorism?
We have massacres in Israel. The missile and artillery shots at Commercial shipping from Yemen
The attacks on US bases and seagoing vessels?
Jordan Hezbollah making threats.

My theory comes from recent intelligence about Iran's nuclear capability. It would seem they have enough enriched plutonium.
I believe all this fire and brimstone in the Middle East may well be an overture to Iran's announcement, not deployment, but announcement, they currently have Nuclear Capability.

Like Iraq's WMD's, only for real.
If so, what will we do?
Thoughts?
 
Why?

Simply because the US has dropped all actual deterrence.

We don't project strength, we project weakness. We look weak. We act weak. So we are being treated as if we are weak. British PM Neville Chamberlain did the same with Hitler's Germany. We are doing it with Iran. If we act nice and turn a blind eye then they won't hurt us. Uh. . .
 
Melensdad said:
Why?

Simply because the US has dropped all actual deterrence.

We don't project strength, we project weakness. We look weak. We act weak. So we are being treated as if we are weak. British PM Neville Chamberlain did the same with Hitler's Germany. We are doing it with Iran. If we act nice and turn a blind eye then they won't hurt us. Uh. . .
Click to expand...

You are stating the obvious. You get a gold star!
Two-dimensional thinking.

Of course we do look weak because we are. Weak in materials, unity, leadership, and purpose.
But this is the first time Iran's nuclear program has fruit.
That is a game changer.

Think about all the elements coming into play.
Our military is depleted in personnel and weapons.
Iran is oil rich, armed, and aligned with Russia, North Korea, and China.

Any idea how many ME terrorist got in over the southern border?

What can we do?
 
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FrancSevin said:
You are stating the obvious. You get a gold star!
Two-dimensional thinking.

Of course we do look weak because we are. Weak in materials, unity, leadership, and purpose.
But this is the first time Iran's nuclear program has fruit.
That is a game changer.

Think about all the elements coming into play.
Our military is depleted in personnel and weapons.
Iran is oil rich, armed, and aligned with Russia, North Korea, and China.

Any idea how many ME terrorist got in over the southern border?

What can we do?
Click to expand...
I don't know, do you suggest that we are too weak and should just roll over and take it? I suggest that if you want to end them do it big , once and for all, like Heroshima. If we are not willing, then pull the troops out of harms way and shut up.
 
m1west said:
I don't know, do you suggest that we are too weak and should just roll over and take it? I suggest that if you want to end them do it big , once and for all, like Heroshima. If we are not willing, then pull the troops out of harms way and shut up.
Click to expand...
Not at all. I said we appear weak.
I am suggesting we may be facing an intractable enemy which has proven they will not stop provoking a fight. An enemy our own government funded thinking we could buy peace. Since the Barbary coast conflict in the early1800s we have seen these people cannot be appeased. They are bullies who have taken our lunch money for too many years.

Back in the'90's we had a situation in Iraq. Suspicion of Hussein's intentions and WMD's. Threatening his neighbors. We had a prime Military backed by a relatively unified and supportive nation. They went in and mopped things up rather easily. Sorta. We are still there, 30 years later, and the situation in the region is not much better.

I would suggest, we are not the nation we were back then.

We do not have the manpower, the materiel, or the resolve to go into Iran as we did Iraq. So, when they threaten, or else, with nuclear capability, what do you suggest could be our options. Keep in mind the foible old man, our commander in Chief, who along with leadership weakness, has likely facilitated the presence of the enemy within our borders.

These conditions are obvious. What concerns me is the new Iranian ability to foist nuclear capability on it's neighbors. The hand wringing America will do as we ponder indecisively what to do. Because we do not have leadership that currently is only decisive about internal social equities and preventing Donald Trump from running for office.

Back to my premise, I suspect the entire flame up in the ME, since the October7th massacres, is a coordinated action using proxies to insight tensions in the region as a preamble to the announcement of nuclear capabilities by Iran. If I am right, then what do we do about it?
 
FrancSevin said:
Not at all. I said we appear weak.
I am suggesting we may be facing an intractable enemy which has proven they will not stop provoking a fight. An enemy our own government funded thinking we could buy peace. Since the Barbary coast conflict in the early1800s we have seen these people cannot be appeased. They are bullies who have taken our lunch money for too many years.

Back in the'90's we had a situation in Iraq. Suspicion of Hussein's intentions and WMD's. Threatening his neighbors. We had a prime Military backed by a relatively unified and supportive nation. They went in and mopped things up rather easily. Sorta. We are still there, 30 years later, and the situation in the region is not much better.

I would suggest, we are not the nation we were back then.

We do not have the manpower, the materiel, or the resolve to go into Iran as we did Iraq. So, when they threaten, or else, with nuclear capability, what do you suggest could be our options. Keep in mind the foible old man, our commander in Chief, who along with leadership weakness, has likely facilitated the presence of the enemy within our borders.

These conditions are obvious. What concerns me is the new Iranian ability to foist nuclear capability on it's neighbors. The hand wringing America will do as we ponder indecisively what to do. Because we do not have leadership that currently is only decisive about internal social equities and preventing Donald Trump from running for office.

Back to my premise, I suspect the entire flame up in the ME, since the October7th massacres, is a coordinated action using proxies to insight tensions in the region as a preamble to the announcement of nuclear capabilities by Iran. If I am right, then what do we do about it?
Click to expand...
So, your suspicion is that this is all a baiting operation by Iran, to get the US and some of our allies closely involved, which has worked, and then when we are on the verge of having no choice but to strike Iran, they reveal that they have nukes, and we back off to avoid a possible nuclear war, thus both making the US look weak and at the same time changing the whole game in the ME, with Iran as the hegemon calling the shots.

If that is their plan, it will probably be effective. That being said, if the US suspected this was their plan, or even if there's a good chance it could be, I see no other option than to strike Iran's nuclear facilities where they may be keeping nuclear weapons, with the ostensible strategy of taking out the "progress" they've made toward developing nuclear weapons, but in reality we might be actually taking out the nuclear weapons themselves. Of course, this runs the risk of setting off their own armed nuclear weapons within Iran, but that could be blamed on Iran because it would appear they were concealing the fact that the sites actually contained nuclear weapons.

In short, we should strike hard first, and ask questions later. That is the only way to ensure greater peace in the ME, IMHO.
 
Patriot said:
So, your suspicion is that this is all a baiting operation by Iran, to get the US and some of our allies closely involved, which has worked, and then when we are on the verge of having no choice but to strike Iran, they reveal that they have nukes, and we back off to avoid a possible nuclear war, thus both making the US look weak and at the same time changing the whole game in the ME, with Iran as the hegemon calling the shots.

If that is their plan, it will probably be effective. That being said, if the US suspected this was their plan, or even if there's a good chance it could be, I see no other option than to strike Iran's nuclear facilities where they may be keeping nuclear weapons, with the ostensible strategy of taking out the "progress" they've made toward developing nuclear weapons, but in reality we might be actually taking out the nuclear weapons themselves. Of course, this runs the risk of setting off their own armed nuclear weapons within Iran, but that could be blamed on Iran because it would appear they were concealing the fact that the sites actually contained nuclear weapons.

In short, we should strike hard first, and ask questions later. That is the only way to ensure greater peace in the ME, IMHO.
Click to expand...
Actually, I'm not suggesting Iran's strategy to bring us to a war. Just their intention to continue extracting "tribute." They will kidnap your people for ransom, or they will lay siege to your homeland unless tribute is paid. These Muslim Arabs have been practicing this method of revenue generation for centuries. It is in their religion, and their DNA.

Taking hostages or laying siege is low risk. So would be the threat of nuclear warfare.

What I am suggesting that their nuclear program may well be just the latest development in their methods.
If so;
What shall or will our response be?
 
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FrancSevin said:
Actually, I'm not suggesting Iran's strategy to bring us to a war. Just their intention to continue extracting "tribute." They will kidnap your people for ransom, or they will lay siege to your homeland unless tribute is paid. These Muslim Arabs have been practicing this method of revenue generation for centuries. It is in their religion, and their DNA.

Taking hostages or laying siege is low risk. So would be the threat of nuclear warfare.

What I am suggesting that their nuclear program may well be just the latest development in their methods.
If so;
What shall or will our response be?
Click to expand...
Ideally, we take action before they announce they have nuclear weapons. If we don't, and they do announce they have nukes, our options are limited. It becomes a North Korea situation, but worse because they are religiously motivated, and have vowed to destroy Israel. Our best option at that point would be to use Saudi Arabia, Turkey, or other Muslim countries to put pressure on Iran to restrain themselves in the name of regional stability and economic prosperity. The only other option is to attempt to take out their nuclear weapons despite the potential it has to start a nuclear war.
 
Patriot said:
Ideally, we take action before they announce they have nuclear weapons. If we don't, and they do announce they have nukes, our options are limited. It becomes a North Korea situation, but worse because they are religiously motivated, and have vowed to destroy Israel. Our best option at that point would be to use Saudi Arabia, Turkey, or other Muslim countries to put pressure on Iran to restrain themselves in the name of regional stability and economic prosperity. The only other option is to attempt to take out their nuclear weapons despite the potential it has to start a nuclear war.
Click to expand...
It won't matter.
Unless we take their Nuclear capability out on the first strike, it won't matter.

Considering the current President, what are the odds of that?

Keep in mind, from the perspective of Iran's leadership, it is not about using nuclear weapons, which would demand and elicit a catastrophic response. It is about threatening to use them, or pay a tribute.

This has been their modus operandi since Obama. It got them $6 billion in unmarked us bills.
 
FrancSevin said:
It won't matter.
Unless we take their Nuclear capability out on the first strike, it won't matter.

Considering the current President, what are the odds of that?

Keep in mind, from the perspective of Iran's leadership, it is not about using nuclear weapons, which would demand and elicit a catastrophic response. It is about threatening to use them, or pay a tribute.

This has been their modus operandi since Obama. It got them $6 billion in unmarked us bills.
Click to expand...
You hit the nail on the head. The problem is the current president. I'm fairly certain this would not be happening if Trump were still the president.

As it stands, we are now in a hard situation. Imagine if Iran strikes us again, worse this time, maybe they, or their proxies, severely damage or sink a US Navy ship, while at the same time China invades Taiwan, and/or Russia uses a tactical nuke in Ukraine.

We have been signaling weakness for too long through half measures or complete lack of response, and it has emboldened our enemies.
 
Patriot said:
You hit the nail on the head. The problem is the current president. I'm fairly certain this would not be happening if Trump were still the president.

As it stands, we are now in a hard situation. Imagine if Iran strikes us again, worse this time, maybe they, or their proxies, severely damage or sink a US Navy ship, while at the same time China invades Taiwan, and/or Russia uses a tactical nuke in Ukraine.

We have been signaling weakness for too long through half measures or complete lack of response, and it has emboldened our enemies.
Click to expand...
Sink a ship? Attack a US base? Really?

Iran's proxies are here, yes here in the USA. One wonders how the hell they managed to get in????
Is my premise yet coming clear?
 
FrancSevin said:
Sink a ship? Attack a US base? Really?

Iran's proxies are here, yes here in the USA. One wonders how the hell they managed to get in????
Is my premise yet coming clear?
Click to expand...
True. It is hard to imagine that out of the thousands of foreigners who have illegally entered our country in the last few years that some of them don't belong to terrorist cells. Although I sincerely hope not, I would not be surprised if we suffer a major terrorist attack on US soil sometime soon. You would think Biden would be doing everything in his power to secure the border and round up those who entered without permission. One terrorist attack and his chances of being re-elected go from maybe to no chance.
 
FrancSevin said:
I don' think he plans to be re-elected. It is more likely he will be re-installed, like the last time.
Click to expand...
I'm encouraged by the polls. Trump has been consistently polling above Biden, unlike in 2020, and the trend is going in Trump's favor, which is probably because the country and the world with Biden as the "leader" of the free world is going into the toilet.

I don't wish for it, but it's likely things will only get worse between now and November. I may be naive, but I have to believe that Americans will do the right thing and put Trump back in the White House. Call it my "audacity of hope."
 
Patriot said:
I'm encouraged by the polls. Trump has been consistently polling above Biden, unlike in 2020, and the trend is going in Trump's favor, which is probably because the country and the world with Biden as the "leader" of the free world is going into the toilet.

I don't wish for it, but it's likely things will only get worse between now and November. I may be naive, but I have to believe that Americans will do the right thing and put Trump back in the White House. Call it my "audacity of hope."
Click to expand...
We Americans did the right thing in 2020.
Some Democrats did the wrong thing.
 
The military industrial complex needs to make as much money as possible before the next election. Wag the dog and all that too. It's about money and the global elite make a lot of money off of war.
 
Patriot said:
True. It is hard to imagine that out of the thousands of foreigners who have illegally entered our country in the last few years that some of them don't belong to terrorist cells. Although I sincerely hope not, I would not be surprised if we suffer a major terrorist attack on US soil sometime soon. You would think Biden would be doing everything in his power to secure the border and round up those who entered without permission. One terrorist attack and his chances of being re-elected go from maybe to no chance.
Click to expand...
Maybe the plan is a false flag or real attack on American soil, so martial law can be declaired and the election canceled??
 
Martial Law?

Are you suggesting Trump would do this if elected or that Biden would so we couldn't vote him out?
 
FrancSevin said:
Martial Law?

Are you suggesting Trump would do this if elected or that Biden would so we couldn't vote him out?
Click to expand...
The left is the real threat to democracy. They have demonstrated time and again their willingness to suspend our Constitutional freedoms in the name of "safety" and "security." They point to the Jan 6 riot as supposed proof that those on the right are the threat, but this only conceals their own tendencies.

If Trump is elected again, and it appears he will be if the election is even close to being conducted fairly, I can foresee the left rioting like we've never witnessed before. They will claim that it is their only choice, because Trump is too much of a "threat to democracy."

As the situation becomes chaotic in multiple cities, the government will have no choice but to declare martial law for our own "safety" and "security." This may sound like something out of a Dean Koontz novel, but remember how the government asserted its power during COVID.
 
We are not a Democracy; we are a Constitutional Republic.

The left wants the USA to be a Democracy where in the majority rules.
 
FrancSevin said:
Martial Law?

Are you suggesting Trump would do this if elected or that Biden would so we couldn't vote him out?
Click to expand...
Biden could cause a situation to declare martial law to stop the election if we had a homeland attack, either real or false flag, these assholes will stop ant nothing to stay in power to further the global agenda.
 
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