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"Tookie Watch"?

Works for me but then I spent most of my life killing people and breaking things or so I have been reminded of lately by those that haven't!!

Dean
 
Yep, ole Jesse tried but he didn't come thru this time. Arnold said he could not grant clemensy partially because Tookie did not admit to killing the people even though the evidence told a different story.
I was afraid Arnold would cave, but he didn't.
 
Just looked. Tookie gone. I guess one should not kill cops and other innocent people.
 
Always sad to see someone die and I would not want it to seem I’m rejoicing in another’s death --- but HOORAY for Arnold. I too thought he would cave. It is about time someone stood up to the liberal Hollywood crowd, Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton. We have laws and a court system. These people shouldn't be allowed to circumvent them.

Way to go Arnold.:applause:
 
Well I am one of those odd conservatives, I am not a big believer in the death penalty and as far as I am concerned, it can go away. But I am also a believer in the laws we have, and since we do have the death penalty then we should use it as it was intended to be used and not the way it is being mis-used. Twookie committed murder how many years ago??? The fact that California and their legal system waited until last night put to him death is the tragedy. From my moral standpoint, we could do away with the death penalty, but as long as we have it, we should not foster a system that delays the imposition of the penalty for decades!

A bigger travesty would have been to pardon him. So I believe under the current laws, Arnold did the best thing that could have been done.

 
B_Skurka said:
we should not foster a system that delays the imposition of the penalty for decades!
Click to expand...
I'm for the death penalty.

Personally, once the sentence is issued, I think the prosecuted should have 5 minutes to say their goodbyes while in the courthouse (since family/friends are probably sitting there anyway) and then take them out back and carry out the sentence.

Now this may be a bit extreme but under certain cases, I also think it may be appropriate to carry out the execution in the fashion of the crimes committed.

Any deterrent to make people consider their fate to possibly (hopefully) detract others from committing these types of crimes...
 
Brian, I think the whole death penalty situation is so terribly mishandled in the US that it is not a deterrant, it puts the families of the victims through an appeals system that makes them relive the events too many times, and it creates a situation where the criminal actually builds up a fan club of supporters. Something is horribly wrong with our system.

While I am not a fan of the death penalty, it seems to me the right way to administer it is much closer to your idea of taking the guy out back and dispatching him in short order.
 
Bob, you may recall earlier this year Indiana executed Donald Ray Wallace. I had a personal interest in this case because I had been in a fist fight with him many years ago and, the father of the family he killed was my immediate supervisor at the time of his death. I'd literally looked into the eyes, nose to nose, of that killer. There was no soul in there. The terrible thing was that he committed this crime in the late 70's and was just executed this year. He made a mockery of our justice system for decades. We spent millions on him.

For those not familiar with Donald Ray Wallace, I'm sure that you can find plenty on him with a quick search of the 'net. A young family, the Patrick Gilligan family, came home and surprised him while he was burglarizing their home. He tied them up with lamp cords and executed them. He made the kids watch the parents die first. He then described how he executed the kids because he didn't want them to grow up with no parents.

If we had a true life in prison without any parole, that may be a different matter. We've all read time and time again about the person sentenced to "life" in prison being released in 20 years. The recidivism rate for these people is very high. They are not productive members of any society. There again, I may be prejudiced because I have a personal tie to this particular tragedy. As I said, I looked into the eyes of a cold blooded killer only months before he killed an innocent family.
 
Dargo said:
I had a personal interest in this case because I had been in a fist fight with him many years ago
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Another fist fight? This was a time when you really could have used your gun (literally). Would have saved alot of time and taxpayer money. :2gunsfiri

Bonehead
 
"If we execute murderers and there is in fact no deterrent effect, we have killed a bunch of murderers. If we fail to execute murderers, and doing so would in fact have deterred other murders, we have allowed the killing of a bunch of innocent victims. I would much rather risk the former. This, to me, is not a tough call."

John McAdams - Marquette University/Department of Political Science, on deterrence​

I'd recommend reading this long document:

http://www.prodeathpenalty.com/DP.html

But I'm more or less in the same camp as BCZoom! 5 Minutes sounds about right to me.
 
Bonehead said:
Another fist fight? This was a time when you really could have used your gun (literally). Would have saved alot of time and taxpayer money.
Click to expand...

Bonehead, I would agree with you there.

Dargo said:
Bob, you may recall earlier this year Indiana executed Donald Ray Wallace.
Click to expand...

Yup, the lights dimmed that day they fried him up. And its is cases like his that make me really wonder why we even have a death penalty. He was a king in jail for roughly 25 years. There are a lot of reasons to oppose the death penalty. One is that they don't administer it quickly. Another is the ultimate cost in $$$ when compared to life in prision. Moral concerns over killing certainly can come into play too. But let's all just be honest and admit the system is broken. Like I said, I'm not a fan of the death penalty, but if we have it, then we should at least use it properly to allow for closure for the family members of the survivors of the victims.

Bear in mind please, I am not a soft on crime guy. If you kill someone, then you need to be locked up with no chance of getting out. Period. I really hate the current system where you kill someone, and then you sit on death row for 10, 20 or 30 years, putting the innocent victim's families through hell while you appeal and appeal and appeal.
 
Archdean said:
Works for me but then I spent most of my life killing people and breaking things or so I have been reminded of lately by those that haven't!!

Dean
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Sounds like you are qualified to work at San Quentin prison! I read that they had a difficult time putting the man to death. Would be a hell of a commute for you though.

Bonehead
 
BoneheadNW said:
Another fist fight? This was a time when you really could have used your gun (literally). Would have saved alot of time and taxpayer money. :2gunsfiri

Bonehead
Click to expand...

Yeah, I used to be rather pugnacious. I even learned how to spell that word in grade school. :o Ole DRW was know an a "bad dude" in those days. I didn't know that at the time. We lumped each other up pretty good at the time. In retrospect, if he wasn't on drugs at the time, he may have come after me later. He likely didn't know what happened to him the next morning. I am sort of surprised that someone didn't plug him before he killed. He made it quite a habit of breaking into people's homes stealing things to support his drug habit. Someone could have saved us money back then if they were armed in their home. DRW didn't discriminate whether anyone was home or not; he broke in either way.
 
B_Skurka said:
There are a lot of reasons to oppose the death penalty. One is that they don't administer it quickly. Another is the ultimate cost in $$$ when compared to life in prision. Moral concerns over killing certainly can come into play too. But let's all just be honest and admit the system is broken.
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Yep, the system is broken.
Cost and moral concerns don't play into my solution. I'm sure someone would donate the ammunition and in most cases, it wouldn't be hard to find someone, even with strong moral convictions to waste the culprit.

PS. Dargo, it's still early... The brain isn't ready for words like "pugnacious" and "recidivism" ;)
 
Oh waaaah! Why in the hell do I keep reading about this convicted killer being upset that it "took a little longer than expected" to get the damn needle in his vein?! Sorry, but I see positively no reason to be concerned about that. I've donated blood plenty of times (got my 3 gallon pin) and sometimes the person isn't as good as others. Big freakin' deal!! He got to breathe a couple of minutes more. Gees! What the heck is it with our media that they seem fixated on the word that this guy was somewhat upset that the needle didn't get placed fast enough. Don't you think he was a little upset that he was going to die?! Give me a break! :soapbox:
 
Hey Dargo,

I also wonder why they wipe his arm off with alcohol so it's clean... Do they think he's going to get an infection or something? :confused:
 
I may have just changed my position on the death penalty. If my position agrees with the Socialist Party in France, then my position must be wrong. By the way, I changed the print below to bold in a couple places where I thought the response was simply outlandishly stupid.


QUENTIN, Calif. - Stanley Tookie Williams maintained his innocence right up until his death, even when an admission of guilt may have spared him execution.

 Williams, the Crips gang co-founder whose case stirred a national debate about capital punishment versus the possibility of redemption, was executed Tuesday morning for killing four people in 1979.

 After he was declared dead, his supporters shouted in unison: "The state of California just killed an innocent man," as they walked out of the chamber.

 Lora Owens, stepmother of one of the four people Williams was convicted of killing witnessed the execution. "I believe it was a just punishment long overdue," she told ABC's "Good Morning America."

 Williams' case became one of the nation's biggest death-row cause celebres in decades, with Hollywood stars and capital punishment foes arguing that Williams' sentence should be commuted to life in prison because he had made amends by writing children's books about the dangers of gangs and violence.

 His execution also drew fierce criticism in Europe, where politicians in Schwarzenegger's native Austria called for his name to be removed from a sports stadium in his hometown.

 "Schwarzenegger has a lot of muscles, but apparently not much heart," said Julien Dray, spokesman for the Socialist Party in France, where the death penalty was abolished in 1981.​
 
Yeah, you know why the abolished the death penalty in France, don't you? For fear that the condemned prisoner could overpower the entire French police and guard population and escape if they really pissed him off. You saw the pictures of ole Tookie with his huge 'fro and loads of muscles in the past. He coulda whipped the entire French army by himself!
 
bczoom said:
I'm for the death penalty.

Personally, once the sentence is issued, I think the prosecuted should have 5 minutes to say their goodbyes while in the courthouse (since family/friends are probably sitting there anyway) and then take them out back and carry out the sentence....
Click to expand...

B_Skurka said:
I think the whole death penalty situation is so terribly mishandled in the US that it is not a deterrant, it puts the families of the victims through an appeals system that makes them relive the events too many times, and it creates a situation where the criminal actually builds up a fan club of supporters. Something is horribly wrong with our system.

While I am not a fan of the death penalty, it seems to me the right way to administer it is much closer to your idea of taking the guy out back and dispatching him in short order.
Click to expand...


I agree with you 100% there. All those appeals just postpone the inevitable and make the defense attorneys rich while teasring the hearts out of the victims families again and again. Not to mention the burden it puts on our prison system to keep them securely tucked away for a decade.
No, get them to their maker as quick as possible after their trial. And somehow we need to keep the media and those jesse jackson type assholes from making it a circus.
Perhaps the prison system needs its own "media" so things can be spun the intended direction.
Hey Jesse, you love to put your nose in everything that doesn't concern you so - Here you go:
:fart2:
 
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