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The downside to driving an EV

mbsieg

mbsieg

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Platinum Patron
Going to post a few of the negatives "I" have experienced.

Charging lines- I've only experienced this a handful of times in the 13,000 miles we've driven EV. I had to wait about 10 minutes. That was 4th of July weekend in ritzville Washington. It looks like it's pretty common in a lot of the west coast states.

Lack of DC fast charging infrastructure- This only is affected us on one trip that we had to change our route. Or we plan a trip that involves an overnight stay where we would need the energy. More and more hotels and airbnbs are putting in chargers or 240 volt plugs. The nice part about this is normally these have been free. Or built into the price of the room. I gladly would pay an extra $10 to have a full battery in the morning.

Range when towing- I use my vehicle more as a car not as a pickup. We do pull snowmobiles to the mountain in the winter with it a lot. I went and grabbed my buddy's camper since the last question about range. I averaged 1 mi per kilowatt pulling a 26 ft bumper hitch at 60 mph It was a sunny calm 80° day. We went on a 85 mi trip to get average.

Cold weather range- I park my vehicle in a heated garage, so the cold does not affect me as much as others. I lose about 10% at 0° f. You do not lose battery percentage in the cold. You lose the ability to get the energy out of the battery. Hence why they heat batteries. But if you are smart about preconditioning the battery, preheating the vehicle before you unplug you will help yourself in the end.
 
So the lovely Mrs_Bob and I were talking today while driving to/from Notre Dame (roughly 90 miles each way) about replacing our diesel Audi A6.

Hyundai Ionic 5 and Fisker Ocean were the comparison vehicles.

Ionic 5 is the top rated EV in the SUV class by almost every professional auto writer/website. Ionic 5, in AWD format, is roughly a 250 mile vehicle and neither of us are thrilled with that. We both want roughly 300 mile range and she demands AWD due ot the 'snow belt' issues off of the southern edge of Lake Michigan. We could make the Ionic 5 work, but it would require the public charging stations more often, which is a downside.

The Fisker Ocean is the new kid on the block, barely starting to deliver pre-orders. Initial reports are that it is still lacking a lot of software features, and since EV's are hugely reliant on computer software, that is a real life problem; at least until it is sorted out. Given a 5-8 month lead time on these vehicles, it might be reasonable to assume that the software will be updates by the time I would get delivery? No actual "ratings' on this vehicle but reviews are generally very favorable, even if the software is not up to promised and the range is superior to other brands.

Mustang Mach E seems like it might work? It seems like it could work, but literally every website lists is below the Ionic 5 in their ratings by a couple of positions.

VW has an EV, but that is ranked below the Mustang Mach E.

Cadillac Lyric might work, except it is a GM product and I've got issues with GM taking gubmint bailout money when they were in financial hardship. I'd have rather let the market work and let bidders buy the various brands. So I'm boycotting GM products.

With the Ionic 5 at roughly 250 mile range, I could get to Notre Dame or Purdue each week (which is typical), and back, on a single charge, even in the winter with the heater running, but it would take 80% of the charge for those trips. Notre Dame is a bit more problematic because we rarely go there & come back. Typically we go there, run a bunch of errands, and then come back, sometimes same day, sometimes with an overnight stay. So charging while there seems like it would be required with the Ionic 5. My weekly trips to Purdue University are simple there/back trips, just under 200 miles round trip (mostly highway miles), from September thru March each year, so Fall/Winter driving; but should not require a recharge.

If I had a 300 mile range I'd feel a lot more comfortable with the Ionic 5 but as the lovely Mrs_Bob requires/demands/stomps her little foot for All Wheel Drive, the Ionic 5 ranges is roughly 250 versus the 340 with the Fisker Ocean. So the Fisker is the choice, but its undeveloped software and lack of service centers are simultaneous deal killers too.

Perhaps the thought of an EV for our use is simply a year or two away while we wait for the technology to get better?

Perhaps a traditional gas/hybrid is the better solution for us for now?
 
Correct, I won't get 250 mile range in the winter. Purdue is South of me, Notre Dame is East of my home, both are under 90 miles each direction so 180 miles round trip. Purdue is not quite as far away, that round trip is closer to a 150 miles round trip.

The lovely Mrs_Bob currently favors the Hyundai Ionic 5, which, oddly, is not on the above chart. It is the 2022 vehicle of the year (blah blah blah) and now in 2023 seems to be pretty established as reliable and solid. 266 mile range with AWD. Even with a 30% loss due to weather, the vehicle will make a round trip to either without a recharge in cold weather. But as noted previously, the Notre Dame trips usually involve driving around and running errands, often an overnight stay, so pretty hard to avoid the need to stop for a "fill up" on those trips. There are convenient chargers at the Toll Road Oasis going to and returning from Notre Dame. I'd just prefer to not have to use them if possible but it makes for an easy solution.

My diesel Audi A6, with a proven 700 mile range, can make that round trip, spend 2 nights there, running errands all day both days, and get home with about a 1/2 a tank+ left over. My Honda Ridgeline has about 400 miles of range on a full tank makes the round trip for a weekend of running errands, but comes home with a 1/4 tank if errand running is extensive.

So for my mind, the Fisker Ocean is the best option, theoretical 340 mile range on a full charge. Subtract 30% if the weather is frigid and it would still do a basic round trip, including 1 or 2 errands/dinners, to Notre Dame visit without a recharge. The HUGE downside to the Fisker is that it is brand spanking new, unproven, etc.


chowderman said:
your range will not be 250 miles in the winter....

www.recurrentauto.com

Best EV for Winter & Cold Weather Range

All vehicles lose efficiency and range in very cold weather. Electric cars are no different. The good news, however, is that this range loss is temporary and not as limiting as many people may think.
www.recurrentauto.com www.recurrentauto.com
Click to expand...
 
I think one of the big downsides to driving an EV right now is the charging ports, charging stations.

TESLA has the most chargers, but not all vehicles are able to use TESLA chargers.

There seems to be a universal shift, or nearly universal shift, announced over the past 2-3 weeks, that other manufacturers are going to "standardize" on the Tesla plug for charging. To my mind that is good news. Tesla is also going to allow for 3rd party APPS to work at Tesla charging stations. The downside is all that stuff is going to take a full model year worth of time to transition. Manufacturers have announced that, beginning model year 2025, they will be using the Tesla plug and protocols.

Even ENERGIZE AMERICA charging stations have announced they will retrofit their stations to use the Tesla plugs by 2025.

There are some "adapters" but based on reviews, YouTube tests, etc, those seem to work with mixed results.

In any case, a standardized plug/charging scheme is good for consumers. Just like all gas nozzles at gas stations are the same size, regardless of the brand of gas getting pumped into the tank, so will standardized plug/protocols for EV consumers.
 
Supposedly early next year. A lot of the vehicles that signed on Ford rivian Chevy, ECT. Are going to have an adapter available. Currently there are no adapters available for DC fast chargers. Other than the Tesla equipped magic dock chargers. You are right, I see a lot of complaints about DC fast charging. Personally I have not had a huge issue. I have had a few in the 15,000 mi of my truck that were slow. But that is growing pains. I do not typically travel east of the Mississippi. Occasionally. I will. I will probably try to use electrify America even when the Tesla system is open, as it is currently cheaper.
 
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It doesn't look like EA is going to completely retrofit. It looks like they will change one of the handles to NACS and leave the other one CCS. Never quite understood why they thought they needed two plugs when you can only use one at a time anyways. Redundancy. Maybe it's the highest failure point. I guess.
 
It will be very interesting to see what comes in the next few years. I do know even in Wyoming, you're seeing more and more electric vehicles on the road.
 
This is just one thing that scares me about electric vehicles. Towing range! Some good real world testing showing the effects of towing a camper. That isn't going to cut it for me. I regularly have a trailer of some sorts hooked up whether it be a flat deck utility trailer, towing a 20ft boat weighing over 5000 lbs, an enclosed cargo trailer, or fifth wheel camper with my current f150. Sure, I can go shorter distances but can I safely tow an 8500lb fifth wheel more than 250km without recharging? And how many charging stations are out there equipped to handle a vehicle towing a trailer? Most I've seen are single stall charging stations tucked in the back corner of a gas station which would be impossible to get a trailer to.

(BTW...I keep asking this question and everyone praising evs keeps avoiding it.....can a fifth wheel hitch be installed in an electric truck? Doesn't matter what brand of truck. Any truck?)

My biggest concern is that we are being forced to eventually switch to electric and I won't be able to do everything I currently do with my truck. Just the other day, I hooked up my sxs and trailer to my f150, drove 100km out to the woods, spent the day hunting then drove 100km home. This past summer, we hooked up the boat to our expedition and fifth wheel to the f150 and headed out 280km to go fishing and camping for the week in a spot where there's only one gas station within 100km and the nearest charging station was a 2 hr drive west. How's that going to work? My issue is being forced to get something I don't want eventually without the infrastructure there to support what we're being forced to. And if anyone says we aren't being forced, I call BS. The Canadian government up here announced that by 2035 everything is scheduled to be electric. If that isn't being forced, I don't know what is.


 
NorthernRedneck said:
This is just one thing that scares me about electric vehicles. Towing range! Some good real world testing showing the effects of towing a camper. That isn't going to cut it for me. I regularly have a trailer of some sorts hooked up whether it be a flat deck utility trailer, towing a 20ft boat weighing over 5000 lbs, an enclosed cargo trailer, or fifth wheel camper with my current f150. Sure, I can go shorter distances but can I safely tow an 8500lb fifth wheel more than 250km without recharging? And how many charging stations are out there equipped to handle a vehicle towing a trailer? Most I've seen are single stall charging stations tucked in the back corner of a gas station which would be impossible to get a trailer to.

(BTW...I keep asking this question and everyone praising evs keeps avoiding it.....can a fifth wheel hitch be installed in an electric truck? Doesn't matter what brand of truck. Any truck?)

My biggest concern is that we are being forced to eventually switch to electric and I won't be able to do everything I currently do with my truck. Just the other day, I hooked up my sxs and trailer to my f150, drove 100km out to the woods, spent the day hunting then drove 100km home. This past summer, we hooked up the boat to our expedition and fifth wheel to the f150 and headed out 280km to go fishing and camping for the week in a spot where there's only one gas station within 100km and the nearest charging station was a 2 hr drive west. How's that going to work? My issue is being forced to get something I don't want eventually without the infrastructure there to support what we're being forced to. And if anyone says we aren't being forced, I call BS. The Canadian government up here announced that by 2035 everything is scheduled to be electric. If that isn't being forced, I don't know what is.


Click to expand...
EV's for the masses are a pipe dream for the reasons you listed and much more, including fires, they are heavier so will be harder on tires and roads plus more energy transfer in a collision. And another no one wants to talk about is wether they want to admit it or not, every time you drive one you are rolling coal wether you like it or not. They are not environmentally friendly no matter how may times the eco nuts say they are, then you have resale value, lithium mines and battery disposal. Just because nothing is coming from the tailpipe doesn't mean they don't pollute.
 
An employee went on vacation recently, and they were trying to get away from it all, and camp, he and his family.
They drove to a remote lake, put up the tent, had a canoe to paddle around.
Day 2 some city slickers pull in and park.
First thing they do is unload their gas powered generator, fire it up, and plug in their EV.
Trying to be tolerant they let this noise go on for a while.
At the 30 minute mark though my employee said his wife walked over to them and said if that generator is still running in 2 minutes that she is picking it up and throwing it in the lake.
They told her about how they had to let it run for at least 36 hours.
She said no bleep bleep bleep way, and to get out of there now, drive far away, and then charge their junk up.
I was laughing so hard listening to this i had tears.
I've met his wife, and then only surprising part was it took her a half hour to go tell them enough.
Their mistake was leaving town and heading south.
If going south from here far enough, we can run into people like that. Joking around I said ' he probably had a man bun to'?
Seems that my joke was correct.
Next trip they are going west or north instead.
 
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