Snow Trac for grooming...

[couchsachraga]

How are Snow Trac's for grooming cross-country ski trails? I've been looking for an Imp or Bombi (preferably with a plow), but there is possibly restorable heap of a Snow Trac for sale nearby (and I'm a sucker for old heaps...).... My trails are very "treed" and have turns...so, can the vario steering turn quick enough, or will I be asking for trouble? I'm assuming you can't put a plow on front, but if the price is right, that's not a deal breaker for me

Also, as this machine needs a ton of work, I know the engine and tranny are VW, but is the remainder of the running gear easy to find, or if the drive wheels are missing am I getting in to having something fabricated? This machine has been sitting for 15 years + as someones project...so I expect a lot of problems!

Thank you in advance for your time and thoughts.

Adam
P.S. I'm used to operating Pisten Bully's and old Alpines, not to mention working on them...and tractors...and backhoes...not to mention "normal" cars and trucks.

 

[Melensdad]

Adam, I'm probably the least experienced Snow Trac/Snowcat owner around, but I can tell you that Snow Tracs are not generally known for their ability to take sharp turns. I ran mine around in the corn fields and hunting land near my property today and while I didn't have any problems turning, these turn more like a large car or SUV than any of the modern snowcats.

 

[Snowcat Operations]

I have to agree with Bob. They have a turning radius like a small car. Also you cant turn the wheel when the vehicle is stopped. If you do you will break your variator. As far as a blade, Yes some came with them. I have never seen one but their add states as much. You can pull 1500 lbs so a groomer is not a problem. Just dont get an Activ (same people who made the Snow Trac/Master) groomer. I am told they were crap at grooming. An Imp or Super Imp would be better for a grooming machine. They can make sharper turns and have a decent deep powder capability. Not as good as a Snow Master but more like a Snow Trac. Hope this helped.

 

[sleddogracer]

in heavy snow, pulling a groomer, sno tracks are very reluctant to turn - in some of the sharper corners on my trail, I had to get out and shovel snow out of the groomer, and from in front of the sno track so I could turn - another thing to look for is ice cleats on the tracks - while they do help immensely when climbing a steep icy slope, they make turning on packed snow or sod a tricky operation - if you're not careful it drives out of it's tracks - with practice, it's not difficult to get the tracks back in place, but at the very least it's annoying and the bogey wheels can be damaged - if I were ever to get another sno track, I'd save it for personal transportation and forget about grooming trails with it

 

[Lyndon]

Snow Trac's are not powerfull enough, and the front of the machine is difficult to attach a blade to. When adjusted properly they turn quite well, very maneuverable. Westermaskiner did offer Snow Master's and Trac Masters as groomers, but they just were not eoungh machine to do the job. The front end is "soft" and it is difficult to attach a blade. I met folks in both Healy Alaska, and in Delta Junction that had watched people plowing with a Snow Trac and all claimed that it was the most manerverable little plow and did a great job. The Snow Masters and Trac Masters usually only lasted a season or two at a ski area. Just not enough engine. A Machine Shop teacher in Maine was using one to dress cross country trails. He had his students completely go thru the machine every year. So it can be done. I purchased a Snow Trac from two guys that used it to groom a grass runway(winter, Snow) so that they could take off and land their bush planes that were equipped with skiis. 4 wheelers and snow mobilers would track up the air field so they dragged a phone pole as a sort of roller. According to a study that Bill Guthrie told me about, Tuckers were the most cost effective at grooming, dollars per mile and maintenance for this application.
My 2 cents.

 

[300 H and H]

Great explanation Lyndon!

My experiance with tracked Ag tractors has been best in field work with the draw bar free to swing from side to side. The front of the draw bar attaches to the midbeam of the tractor, and would work on the snow trac midbeam as well. This lets the tractor start to turn, with out the load trying to stop it from turning. Once the turn is initiated, it is much easier to turn in tighter. If someone would fabricate the frame such as to accomindate the long swinging draw bar, I think it would be a big help when doing heavy towing with a Snow Trac.

Regards, Kirk

 

[sleddogracer]

at the time, I knew nothing about ram steering - I might have been much happier towing the groomer if I had ram steering - that way power is maintained to both tracks, even in the corners

 

[louis]

Snowtrac grooming with custom made small leveling drag

You made one side at a time

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dV7ImOXzHZc"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dV7ImOXzHZc[/ame]

 

[sleddogracer]

a small drag like the one in the video would work fine on a trail that was already smooth and just needed the finishing touches, if leaving the marks of one track wasn't a problem - in rough terrain, the longer the drag, the better the results - 12' - 16' long works well - ideally it would have hydraulic controls so the amount of snow being moved could be adjusted - it would have a pan at the back to leave a smooth finish, ( or corrugated if desired ), be wide enough to cover the evidence of both of the snow cat tracks in one pass ( in the case of the sno-trac, that's 6' wide )

 

[akimp]

My Skidoo skandic WT groomed and pulled better through the trees than my Snow Trac. The snow trac pulling a load would not turn that well going up hill and was very under powered, the Skandic pulled 800lbs a lot easier. Going with a Super wide track next year for grooming. Granted my trails are very tight and steep so flat land would be different. Loved pulling a load in my T-shirt in the Snow Trac though.

 

[300 H and H]

A swinging draw bar as in an AG tractor would help out a Snow Trac a lot if some one were to add one to their machine...

It would let the machine turn under load without it affecting it's turning abilities. As I said before we know this from running 350HP 35,000 lb. Ag tractors with rubber tracks. Huge difference when you unpin the drawbar and let it swing with the load...

This would help any two tracked snow cat BTW... The pivot point of the draw bar should be in the center of the track frame..

Regards, Kirk

 

[JimVT]

I never have run my draw bar loose. I thought it was just for locking in position. I can see that it would give some give for cornering.

 

[Snowcat Operations]

1972 Japan Winter Olympics.