Imp Wiper Upgrade

cloudcap

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Super Patron
Last year was my first season with a snowcat and I was surprised by the amount of rain and slop I had to slog through. I guess I naively thought that I'd always be floating across powder covered hills under cloudless blue skies. And all of that is OK, but I ended up using my windshield wipers a *lot* more than I expected. I quickly tired of the very basic wipers that came on the Imp, so one of my planned summer upgrades was a new set of self-parking wiper motors with an intermittent setting and pantographic arms. Summer is now almost gone (OK, it is long gone, but I don't want to sound like too much of a procrastinator), so it is time to get started on the project.

As with any project, my first step was to scour the web for ideas and/or parts. I found that www.vetus.nl/us/index.php makes a series of wiper motors that are the same form-factor as the original Bosch motors. Their model RW08S is self-parking with two speeds and can use pantographic arms, so it is an almost perfect match for what I was looking for. The only thing that was missing is an intermittent controller. I ordered a set of motors, arms, blades, and a switch from www.go2marine.com and it all arrived last week.

IMG_8503.jpg

Here's the old and new motors -- as you can see they're the same size and shape, with the only real difference being the color and wires. The old motor had an integral on/off switch while the new motor has four pigtails that will connect to the wiper switch.

Installing the new motor was fairly straightforward. You have to punch another hole above the windshield for the second wiper arm and I had to cut down the length of the second wiper arm as it collided with the motor. The most complicated part of the project was setting up the geometry of the blades -- you can adjust the wiping angle (85 to 120 degrees), the length of the arms, and the position of the blade. Eventually I settled on 110 degrees, max arm length, and the upper blade mounting position. This clears the maximum amount of the upper portion of the window.

IMG_8506.jpg

Here's the new setup. Note -- the new wiper is on the right. When I install the second motor I'll have it park on the right so that both blades will be in the middle when they're not being used. Since both motors will run off a common switch they'll look like they run in sync.

My next task is the wiring. The wiring itself is pretty basic, but I'm going to go ahead and rewire everything in the top of the cab since I'm in the neighborhood (wipers, dome light, beacon, and future spotlight). I spent some time looking at different connector systems and settled on Amp's MATE-N-LOCK line of connectors -- they run from a single wire up to 15. I've ordered a pile of connector housings, pins, and crimp tools as well as wire and expandable sheathing from www.waytekwire.com. I also picked up a couple LED dome lights -- we'll see if they're any better than the stock one. It will be a couple weeks before the parts come in and I'm able to build up a wiring harness for this, but I'll add to this post when I'm finished.

Regards

Ron
 
i like that system i wonder if i could add some thing like that to my snow trac with the storms i get around here and the fact search and rescue is likely to call me out this winter now that the national guard is shut down full time opps it would be nice to see in bad weather i will have to do some mesurements see if that would work on mine keep up the good work
 
That looks like an outstanding modification and improvement. Thank you for sharing your project.

The wipers in my Tucker are mediocre at best and the addition of pantographic arms would be a major improvement. My recollection is Tucker used one wiper motor to power both wiper arms.

I'm wondering how difficult it would be to install the pantographic arms and greatly improve the swept area. Could you offer any hints, suggestions, etc?
 
That looks like an outstanding modification and improvement. Thank you for sharing your project.

The wipers in my Tucker are mediocre at best and the addition of pantographic arms would be a major improvement. My recollection is Tucker used one wiper motor to power both wiper arms.

I'm wondering how difficult it would be to install the pantographic arms and greatly improve the swept area. Could you offer any hints, suggestions, etc?

A few thoughts for you:

  • I'm a long ways from expert. I'm halfway through one project, so it is almost guaranteed that other folks on the list have more relevant expertise.

  • That said, I'm doubtful that you can retrofit pantographic arms onto an existing set of windshield wiper shafts. Most (actually, all) of the arms I've seen are designed to work with a matching set of shafts and/or motors.

  • Regarding the swept area, I was rather disappointed to find that my new system only provides a modest increase in the area -- maybe 5%. But what it does do is put the swept area right in front of the driver, whereas the old wipers had the skinny part of the wedge in front of the driver and the fat part down low.
The one thing that made me willing to tackle this was the ability to get a new motor that was extremely close to the existing one -- that eliminated most of the uncertainties about design, fit, and geometry. If you can find a pantographic system that is close to what you have in the Tucker today then I'd say "go for it", but if you're looking at a new design from scratch then it wouldn't be the first project I'd tackle.

Good luck.

Ron
 
Ron,

Thank you for the informative and detailed response with links. I very much appreciate you insight and experience.

I can figure out if I want to try and tackle this project, but I think your comment about other projects coming first is most appropriate.

Again, Thank You!
 
That wiper motor pictured looks like one I've been searching for (for a non-snocat application). I checked with John Deere and the cost was $212. A used supply source quoted $100 for a used one. I tried to find a price list on the Vetus site, but only got as far as the page with the picture of the wiper motor. I'm probably not very computer-savvy.
 
That wiper motor pictured looks like one I've been searching for (for a non-snocat application). I checked with John Deere and the cost was $212. A used supply source quoted $100 for a used one. I tried to find a price list on the Vetus site, but only got as far as the page with the picture of the wiper motor. I'm probably not very computer-savvy.

Vetus is the manufacturer, but I purchased the gear from Go2Marine. The cost (new) is $95 -- here's a link to the page in their catalog: http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=76380F

Ron
 
Thanks for the catalog page. Looks good.
Anything that smacks of John Deere green and yellow is probably over-priced.
 
OK, I've pretty much finished the wiper conversion on my Imp. I still have a couple related tweaks to do, but the big pieces of functionality are done.

IMG_8535.jpg

I had some rain this afternoon as I was finishing up, so you can see the area that is wiped by the new blades. As I mentioned earlier, the total area wiped by the new blades is about the same as the original ones, but it is wider and higher (i.e., more of the area directly in front of the driver and passenger). Don't ask about the black tape over the passenger windshield or I'll have to tell you that someone might have drilled the hole for the second wiper shaft on the wrong side of the main shaft and I'd really rather not do that.

IMG_8533.jpg

One of the surprises I had when I first fired up the wipers was that they wouldn't turn off. Since the motors are self-parking there's an internal switch that continues to provide power until the 'park' position is reached. I'm running two motors off a single master switch and they tend to wander out of sync when they're running, so when you turn them off they both don't reach 'park' at the same time. When one internal switch turns off because it reaches the park position that motor is then powered by the internal switch on the other motor because it hasn't reached park yet. And vice versa. Only when both wipers reach the park position at the same time do they finally stop. The solution was to install a rectifier in the appropriate power lead so that it can't back-feed the off-side wiper motor. Works fine.

IMG_8543.jpg

Here you can see both wiper motors, the new wiring harness, an extra wire (looped) for a future spotlight, and one of the new LED dome lights. There's a position for a second dome light in the back of the cab, but I'm waiting on a replacement (the first one was DOA). You can also see the two aluminum grab-handles I installed over the windshields to make getting in and out a little easier (there's also one over each door on the outside). $7.99 each from Northern Tool & Equipment -- http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200333794_200333794.

The Amp MATE-N-LOCK connectors were a life-saver. Being able to pull out the motors without having to cut wires or fiddle with a bunch of individual connectors saved a ton of time. Plus, it made it possible to build up the wiring harness in chunks -- I've got one harness that runs from behind the control panel and up to the top of the cab and a second (smaller) harness on the back of the control panel.

IMG_8538.jpg

Finally, here's the wiper switch on the control panel. Since the new dome lights have an integral switch I no longer need their toggle switch in the panel. That allowed me to reuse the hole for the new wiper switch without having to drill another hole. That saved a bit of time, but it also eliminated the (theoretical) possibility that someone might drill the new hole in the wrong place.

So, with a snowcat with new wipers and a snazzy dome light I'm ready for rain, sleet (snow), and the dark of night -- I should be delivering mail....

Regards

Ron
 
Ron,

Extra hole or not, I think you did a really first class job.

Thank you for sharing, and taking the time to do such a thorough job explaining the process to the rest of us.

Great Job!!!
 
That is a really good upgrade for your wipers. Nice job and a very good idea on the upgrade . I have been looking hard at doing this also after seeing your post. Which wiper arms did you use for your up grade ? Nice job !!!!
 
first rate job re wiring my snow trac will be my next project behind the dash looks like a snakes nest and i have a set of new gauges for volts oil pressure and cylinder head temp to install
 
.... Which wiper arms did you use for your up grade ? ....

FYI, here's a parts list for the Vetus gear I used:

View attachment go2marine.pdf

I purchased the equipment from www.go2marine.com and was happy with their pricing and delivery.

I used the 12" wiper blade, but were I to do it over again I'd look hard at the 16" one -- I think I could cover more of the windshield that way. I'd probably have to set the arms to a shorter length and go with a wider sweep area, but that's all within the adjustment capabilities of the existing arms and motor.

I should also point out that I'm not totally thrilled with the way the powered wiper arm connects to the motor shaft. The hole in the arm is quite a bit bigger than the motor shaft (i.e., there's some extra room so that it can wiggle around) and a single set-screw is used to clamp it tightly. So far it seems OK, but I haven't had it out in the field yet. I note that Vetus has come out with a newer motor (the DIN1225 as an alternative to the RW08S) that allegedly has a better connection system, but Go2Marine wasn't able to get it from the manufacturer. After waiting most of the summer I finally decided to go ahead and order the older style motor and arms. I'm hoping that I won't regret that decision when I'm out in the woods this winter.

Regards

Ron
 
Thank You, Ron for the information on the wiper arms and motors. It did look like you mite be able to use the 16" wiper blades good luck.
 
Hi Cloudcap. Just wondering if you are still happy with the wiper upgrade you did . I am looking to do the same to my DMC 1450. Ron
 
Hi Cloudcap. Just wondering if you are still happy with the wiper upgrade you did . I am looking to do the same to my DMC 1450. Ron

Quite. Before I owned a cat I didn't realize how important it is to have good wipers -- I guess I thought I'd be gliding through sunlit meadows of snow. The reality is that rain, snow, and crud are always getting flipped onto the windshield and having good wipers is essential. The original ones sorta worked, but the new ones wipe better and having them run off of a switch on the dash is a big win. I'm thinking about adding a push-button to the top of one of the sticks so that I can "wipe once" (so to speak) without having to reach all the way down to the dash. Clearly I'm getting lazy in my old age....

Ron
 
I have that feature in a machine I groom with you are going to love it.

Put a washer on the other stick.

Mike
 
Ron,

Something to consider is that wiper arms (for a cat at least) should be metal & not carbon composite/plastic.

I put on the same setup as you did on mine, and due to freeze, already busted one of the arms,

Will upgrade to the metal one - I highly recommend.

LOOK GREAT THOU... I like how those tuck away nicely
 
Cloudcap, can you explain what the rectifier does, how to install it, and where to buy one? Also, you mentioned that the blade attachment to the motor seemed a little too loose. Is that still a problem? Thanks, ronfam
 
Cloudcap, can you explain what the rectifier does, how to install it, and where to buy one?

When you turn off a self-parking wiper it will keep moving till it reaches the 'park' position and will then stop. If you run two wiper motors by connecting them in parallel to a single switch (as I did) then there's an adverse interaction between the two motors. The root cause is more than I want to get into here (I'd need to draw lots of pictures), but the symptom is the system of two motors takes forever to park. If the different wipers are at all out of sync (which is almost assured) then they will continue to run and run and run until both happen to hit the 'park' position at the same time. The rectifier solves this problem.

I picked up a 1 amp rectifier from Radio Shack, but any electronics shop will do -- this is not a highly specialized part. Pick the lead on the wiper motor that is connected to the battery all the time (i.e., it does not go through the wiper switch) and insert the rectifier in line. Plus side toward the battery, negative toward the wiper motor. Do the same thing for both motors. Voila -- problem averted.

The is actually a pretty cool/obscure problem and I was really excited when I first discovered it. The solution was even better because it is fairly elegant (in my biased opinion). But it is, unfortunately, rather hard to explain. If none of this makes sense then go ahead and set up the wipers w/o the rectifiers -- you'll fairly quickly see what the problem is. And it isn't that hard to install the rectifiers after the fact (that's what I did), so you don't lose a lot by waiting.

you mentioned that the blade attachment to the motor seemed a little too loose. Is that still a problem?

No. While I don't like the way the wiper arms attach to the motors, it has never been a problem. I was apparently making a mountain out of a mole hill.

Regards

Ron
 
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